TEST THE SPIRITS: BUSH-CHENEY POLITICAL CULT AKIN TO FASCISM IDOLATRY

Question:

What’s the difference between Clinton & Bush ? Clinton taxed big corporations and gave to the poor. Clinton gave this nation a $230 billion dollar surplus. Bush’s backdoor taxes have given this nation a $413 billion dollar deficit. Bush spent $200b on Iraq and Afgan with no result on Bin Laden. He didn’t create jobs, because he refused to subtract a huge job loss. Who’s going to pay that bill ? Kerry will stick it to the big corporations that are profiting from a bogus war in Iraq.

Response:

GOP AS FASCIST CULT THIS IS A HUMDINGER!

LIBERAL Feminazis just want to "get it" on with Kobe

Question:

What is it about you Neo Nazi rednecks who peddle the village idiot Bush’s LIES and feel that you have to steal other peoples newsgroup identities to make your lying point. These are the handiworks of your hero Bush, a war lord who history will place on the record right alongside his mentor Adolph Hitler. http://www.robert-fisk.com/iraqwarvictims_page1.htm http://www.salaf.indiaaccess.com/us/israeli_tortures_to_palestinian.htm You people like the old Roman Church confuse Christ with satan. 2Corinthians11:14 "And no marvel for satan himself is transformed into an angel of light." Matt 24:15 and Mark 13: 14—- "Standing in the Holy place where it should NOT be you will see the Awful Horror which Daniel warned about." But of course, you must be one of these wackos from one of the  thousands of  right wing Christian cults, who are waiting for Jesus to return to earth flying on a cloud like captain zap with his army of fixed wing angels, wiping out anything which does not have inscribed on it "the mark of the beast, KHRISTIANITY?" Peter Terry, is in Australia posting from iprimus.com, while this skinhead posting under my non de plume is posting from gblx.net.

and NOT

"The fact is that the GOP is still the only place where a Klansman can feel at home."  —David Duke, 2002 Hence gblx; scumbags, Christian KKK, Christian Neo Nazis and the evil Bush cheer squad please PeterT

Response:

LIBERAL Feminazis just want to "get it" on with Kobe N.O.W.: Ladies! Open your arms + legs to Kobe! N.O.W.’s Man of the Year: Kobe Bryant Ladies and Lesbians: I am pleased to present the National Organization for Wymyn’s Man of the Year Award. And the envelope please … N.O.W.’s Man of the Year Award for 2004 goes to … [Wild Wymyn Applause] Kobe Bryant!!! [Wild Wymyn Applause] For his ceaseless and undying efforts at giving the Wymyn of Colorado and elsewhere what they really, really, really want!!! [Wild Wymyn Applause] Go Kobe! Go Kobe! Go Kobe! [Wild Wymyn Applause] Kobe symbolizes our great LIBERAL legal system where the Colorado Court LEAKS information about rape victims not once, not twice, but THREE [3] times!!! [Wild Wymyn Applause] Let’s give it up for Kobe: our ideal MAN HUNK!!! [Wild Wymyn Applause] Kobe is such a gracious, considerate, and loyal MAN HUNK who gave his cheated wife a 12-carat DIAMOND ring not once, not twice, but THREE [3] times!!! [Wild Wymyn Applause] Ladies and Lesbians, let’s open our arms and legs for Kobe!!! [Wild Wymyn Applause] Ladies and Lesbians, I must confess it was a difficult choice this year, but I would like to congratulate this year’s First Runner-up — and no, it’s not Gloria Allred — [Wild Wymyn Applause] — for her focus on Michael Jackson — our congratulations go to First Runner-up Pamela Macke!!! [Wild Wymyn Applause] Pamela Macke proves once again that a wymyn is MAN enough and has the balls and ethics to take on our great LIBERAL legal system!!! You go, girl!!! [Wild Wymyn Applause] X O X O X Billary Rod-on-Her Clitoris on Sexual Harassment "The War in Iraq demonstrates that President Bush is not upholding laws against sexual harassment and discrimination." — Billary Rod-on-Her Clitoris, in a speech before N.O.W. feminazis and other leftists protesting Operation Iraqi Freedom, Washington, DC Leftist protestors are just that: leftists who can only bitch and protest, because they are bitches who can’t and don’t *DO* anything constructive. Why Hillary Clinton is an inspiration for all women Hillary stands by her girly-man who is a: + dis-barred lawyer + serial adulterer + serial perjurer and liar + dirty old bastard who preys upon females the same age as his daughter LIBERAL Lessons from Kobe Bryant + Scott Peterson Cases Soccer Moms and other Women! Do you want LIBERAL judges who rule against rape victims? Do you want LIBERAL judges who free murderers? Do you want LIBERAL feminazis who want to kill you and your baby in your pregnancy? Did Lacey Peterson have a "choice"? Do soccer moms want LIBERAL judges + Kobe Bryant + O.J.? WOMEN of the world unite! LIBERAL Demon-KKK-Rat John KKKerry opposes the death penalty, he supports rights for dirty muslim terrorists and criminals, and he promises to appoint LIBERAL judges to the U.S. Supreme Court. By contrast, President George W. Bush and the Party of Lincoln support the death penalty and support TOUGH JUDGES who protect women’s rights to be free from rape, murder, assault, battery, and terrorism. Please protect our sisters, daughters and mothers: vote Bush/Cheney! Feminists Silent on Freedom for Iraqi Women by Lisa De Pasquale http://www.cblpolicyinstitute.org/silenceoniraqiwomen.htm The transfer of sovereignty to the Iraqi government marks a new day for Iraqi women. Thanks to the courageous action taken by the Bush administration and its allies, Iraqi women have renewed freedom. The administration has insisted that women receive educational and small business opportunities, as well as active participation in government. For months radical feminists have been silent on the plight of Iraqi women. Instead this hypocritical bunch has condemned the war in Iraq and its subsequent liberation of women simply because the war is supported by conservatives. In March feminists gathered in front of the White House to protest military action against Saddam Hussein. The protest was called "Code Pink: Women’s Pre-Emptive Strike for Peace." On the other side of the world, Iraqi women were being denied the most basic (Indian)n lived in fear knowing that Iraqi law freely allowed male relatives to murder them in the name of honor. In Iraqi prisons, women were raped and tortured for being related to Iraqi opposition activists. Videotapes of the acts were sent to the families. Despite obvious human rights violations and limits on freedom, feminists, led by the National Organization for Women, ignored Saddam Hussein’s reprehensible treatment of women. Under the Saddam Hussein regime Iraqi women were not allowed to work outside the home. Feminists, on the other hand, talked about America’s "tyrants" and the threat of "tyranny in our homes, our workplaces and our schools." Radical feminists witnessed a legitimate case of tyranny and violence against women in Iraq, but they remained steadfastly against policies and actions taken by America and the Bush administration that helped these women. NOW President Kim Gandy stated, "The real terrorism is the Bush administration’s disregard for international law and destruction of civil liberties at home. This has become an issue of one dictator versus another." Feminists are more comfortable allowing Iraqi women to endure torture than supporting the Bush Administration. For example, a report by Amnesty International documented the beheading of 50 young women in Baghdad. The report also said, "The heads of these women were hung on the doors of their houses for a few days." Saddam’s son Uday led the group of men who beheaded the women and terrorized their families. The US State Department reports that human rights organizations receive continuous testimony on the psychological trauma women have suffered after being tortured and raped by Iraqi military personnel. Despite this overwhelming evidence, feminists in the US praised Iraq and cited a suspicious United Nations report that said Iraq "scored highest in women’s empowerment." Before the capture of Saddam, NOW stated in a press release posted on their website that Iraqi women "currently enjoy more rights and freedoms than women in other Gulf nations, such as Saudi Arabia." At an International Alliance for Justice press conference in 2002, Safia al-Souhail, an Iraqi woman whose father was murdered for opposing Saddam, said, "We are here begging the support of the free world to liberate us from the nightmare we have been living in for the past three decades." Al-Souhail also said, "Disarmament alone will not end our suffering. This regime should be indicted for its crimes against humanity." NOW and their cohorts were deaf to these women’s pleas and still condemn the war in Iraq. Feminists invent problems in the US and ignore the real problems faced by women around the world. NOW accuses President Bush of "reversing women’s rights here and abroad." Feminist Majority leader Eleanor Smeal odiously said that the Bush Administration "needs to construct a foreign policy as if women mattered." The deceptively titled March for Women’s Lives in April brought thousands of feminists and leftist supporters to Washington, DC. Rather than march against the atrocities and violence against women in Iraq and other countries around the world, feminists waved coat hangers and demanded taxpayer-funded abortions. Cybill Shepherd held a sign that said, "Too bad John Ashcroft’s mother didn’t believe in abortion." Amid "Fire Bush," "Tarts for Choice" and other placards feminist icon Gloria Steinem told the crowd, "This government is the greatest danger on earth!" Echoing the hateful and hysterical rhetoric, Senator Hillary Clinton, with no apparent sense of irony regarding the previous administration, said she was there to criticize President Bush for "not upholding laws against sexual harassment and discrimination." These radical feminists’ stance on military action in Iraq and the global war on terrorism illustrate how they have consistently fallen short of their purported mission to "eliminate sexism and eliminate all oppression." Their motives are clearly political and not based on advancing the rights of women around the world. When faced with a war that liberated the Iraqi people, a majority of whom are women, feminists would much rather turn a blind eye to the horrors of Saddam than support America and the Bush Administration. Chappaquiddick Kennedy = Racist + Rapist + Adulterer + Murderer Demon-KKK-Rats have not only lost the Latino, Asian, and Black vote, they’ve also lost the vast soccer mom/professional woman vote as well. It is no coincidence that rapists, adulterers, and murderers like Chappaquiddick Kennedy and Billary KKKlinton are the stars of the Demon-KKK-Ratic party. See: http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/JFKkopechne.htm

Response:

KKKlinton Blames His Slutty Momma ~ Feminazis Call Rape Victims Sluts + Bimbos

Question:

KKKlinton Blames His Slutty Momma ~ Feminazis Call Rape Victims Sluts + Bimbos Willam Jefferson "Raped Back Women" KKKlinton blames his slutty momma for his sexual predation. Rape is about power and KKKlinton is the biggest rapist in the world. Like a true LIBERAL Feminazi, Billary KKKlinton, blames everyone but her filthy husband and calls rape victims "bimbos" and "sluts." KKKerry steals from his momma’s trust fund and has sex for money from his ugly wife’s trust fund. Soccer Moms and other women! Are these the girly men you wish to see in power? Don’t bother reporting rape: LIBERAL judges don’t care LIBERAL Lessons from Kobe Bryant + Scott Peterson Cases Soccer Moms and other Women! Do you want LIBERAL judges who rule against rape victims? Do you want LIBERAL judges who free murderers? Do you want LIBERAL feminazis who want to kill you and your baby in your pregnancy? Did Lacey Peterson have a "choice"? Do soccer moms want LIBERAL judges + Kobe Bryant + O.J.? WOMEN of the world unite! LIBERAL Demon-KKK-Rat John KKKerry opposes the death penalty, he supports rights for dirty muslim terrorists and criminals, and he promises to appoint LIBERAL judges to the U.S. Supreme Court. By contrast, President George W. Bush and the Party of Lincoln support the death penalty and support TOUGH JUDGES who protect women’s rights to be free from rape, murder, assault, battery, and terrorism. Please protect our sisters, daughters and mothers: vote Bush/Cheney! Why Hillary Clinton is an inspiration for all women Hillary stands by her girly-man who is a: + dis-barred lawyer + serial adulterer + serial perjurer and liar + dirty old bastard who preys upon females the same age as his daughter The Truth about islam http://www.flex.com/~jai/satyamevajayate/ Girl, 16, hanged in public in Iran http://www.iranfocus.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=80 Fri. 20 Aug 2004 On Sunday, August 15, a 16-year-old girl in the town of Neka, northern Iran, was executed. Ateqeh Sahaleh was hanged in public on Simetry Street off Rah Ahan Street at the city center. The sentence was issued by the head of Neka’s Justice Department and subsequently upheld by the mullahs’ Supreme Court and carried out with the approval of Judiciary Chief Mahmoud Shahroudi. In her summary trial, the teenage victim did not have any lawyer and efforts by her family to recruit a lawyer was to no avail. Ateqeh personally defended herself. She told the religious judge, Haji Rezaii, that he should punish the main perpetrators of moral corruption not the victims. The judge personally pursued Ateqeh’s death sentence, beyond all normal procedures and finally gained the approval of the Supreme Court. After her execution Rezai said her punishment was not execution but he had her executed for her "sharp tongue." Feminists Silent on Freedom for Iraqi Women by Lisa De Pasquale http://www.cblpolicyinstitute.org/silenceoniraqiwomen.htm The transfer of sovereignty to the Iraqi government marks a new day for Iraqi women. Thanks to the courageous action taken by the Bush administration and its allies, Iraqi women have renewed freedom. The administration has insisted that women receive educational and small business opportunities, as well as active participation in government. For months radical feminists have been silent on the plight of Iraqi women. Instead this hypocritical bunch has condemned the war in Iraq and its subsequent liberation of women simply because the war is supported by conservatives. In March feminists gathered in front of the White House to protest military action against Saddam Hussein. The protest was called "Code Pink: Women’s Pre-Emptive Strike for Peace." On the other side of the world, Iraqi women were being denied the most basic (Indian)n lived in fear knowing that Iraqi law freely allowed male relatives to murder them in the name of honor. In Iraqi prisons, women were raped and tortured for being related to Iraqi opposition activists. Videotapes of the acts were sent to the families. Despite obvious human rights violations and limits on freedom, feminists, led by the National Organization for Women, ignored Saddam Hussein’s reprehensible treatment of women. Under the Saddam Hussein regime Iraqi women were not allowed to work outside the home. Feminists, on the other hand, talked about America’s "tyrants" and the threat of "tyranny in our homes, our workplaces and our schools." Radical feminists witnessed a legitimate case of tyranny and violence against women in Iraq, but they remained steadfastly against policies and actions taken by America and the Bush administration that helped these women. NOW President Kim Gandy stated, "The real terrorism is the Bush administration’s disregard for international law and destruction of civil liberties at home. This has become an issue of one dictator versus another." Feminists are more comfortable allowing Iraqi women to endure torture than supporting the Bush Administration. For example, a report by Amnesty International documented the beheading of 50 young women in Baghdad. The report also said, "The heads of these women were hung on the doors of their houses for a few days." Saddam’s son Uday led the group of men who beheaded the women and terrorized their families. The US State Department reports that human rights organizations receive continuous testimony on the psychological trauma women have suffered after being tortured and raped by Iraqi military personnel. Despite this overwhelming evidence, feminists in the US praised Iraq and cited a suspicious United Nations report that said Iraq "scored highest in women’s empowerment." Before the capture of Saddam, NOW stated in a press release posted on their website that Iraqi women "currently enjoy more rights and freedoms than women in other Gulf nations, such as Saudi Arabia." At an International Alliance for Justice press conference in 2002, Safia al-Souhail, an Iraqi woman whose father was murdered for opposing Saddam, said, "We are here begging the support of the free world to liberate us from the nightmare we have been living in for the past three decades." Al-Souhail also said, "Disarmament alone will not end our suffering. This regime should be indicted for its crimes against humanity." NOW and their cohorts were deaf to these women’s pleas and still condemn the war in Iraq. Feminists invent problems in the US and ignore the real problems faced by women around the world. NOW accuses President Bush of "reversing women’s rights here and abroad." Feminist Majority leader Eleanor Smeal odiously said that the Bush Administration "needs to construct a foreign policy as if women mattered." The deceptively titled March for Women’s Lives in April brought thousands of feminists and leftist supporters to Washington, DC. Rather than march against the atrocities and violence against women in Iraq and other countries around the world, feminists waved coat hangers and demanded taxpayer-funded abortions. Cybill Shepherd held a sign that said, "Too bad John Ashcroft’s mother didn’t believe in abortion." Amid "Fire Bush," "Tarts for Choice" and other placards feminist icon Gloria Steinem told the crowd, "This government is the greatest danger on earth!" Echoing the hateful and hysterical rhetoric, Senator Hillary Clinton, with no apparent sense of irony regarding the previous administration, said she was there to criticize President Bush for "not upholding laws against sexual harassment and discrimination." These radical feminists’ stance on military action in Iraq and the global war on terrorism illustrate how they have consistently fallen short of their purported mission to "eliminate sexism and eliminate all oppression." Their motives are clearly political and not based on advancing the rights of women around the world. When faced with a war that liberated the Iraqi people, a majority of whom are women, feminists would much rather turn a blind eye to the horrors of Saddam than support America and the Bush Administration.

Response:

What is it about you Neo Nazi rednecks who peddle the village idiot Bush’s LIES and feel that you have to steal other peoples newsgroup identities to make your lying point. These are the handiworks of your hero Bush, a war lord who history will place on the record right alongside his mentor Adolph Hitler. http://www.robert-fisk.com/iraqwarvictims_page1.htm http://www.salaf.indiaaccess.com/us/israeli_tortures_to_palestinian.htm You people like the old Roman Church confuse Christ with satan. 2Corinthians11:14 "And no marvel for satan himself is transformed into an angel of light." Matt 24:15 and Mark 13: 14—- "Standing in the Holy place where it should NOT be you will see the Awful Horror which Daniel warned about." But of course, you must be one of these wackos from one of the  thousands of  right wing Christian cults, who are waiting for Jesus to return to earth flying on a cloud like captain zap with his army of fixed wing angels, wiping out anything which does not have inscribed on it "the mark of the beast, KHRISTIANITY?" Peter Terry, is in Australia posting from iprimus.com, while this skinhead posting under my non de plume is posting from gblx.net.

and NOT

"The fact is that the GOP is still the only place where a Klansman can feel at home."  —David Duke, 2002 Hence gblx; scumbags, Christian KKK, Christian Neo Nazis and the evil Bush cheer squad please PeterT

Response:

Response:

KKKlinton Blames His Slutty Momma ~ Feminazis Call Rape Victims Sluts + Bimbos Willam Jefferson "Raped Back Women" KKKlinton blames his slutty momma for his sexual predation. Rape is about power and KKKlinton is the biggest rapist in the world. Like a true LIBERAL Feminazi, Billary KKKlinton, blames everyone but her filthy husband and calls rape victims "bimbos" and "sluts." KKKerry steals from his momma’s trust fund and has sex for money from his ugly wife’s trust fund. Soccer Moms and other women! Are these the girly men you wish to see in power? Chelsea Clinton: Why My Mom + Dad Are Great Role Models LIBERAL Lessons from Kobe Bryant + Scott Peterson Cases Soccer Moms and other Women! Do you want LIBERAL judges who rule against rape victims? Do you want LIBERAL judges who free murderers? Do you want LIBERAL feminazis who want to kill you and your baby in your pregnancy? Did Lacey Peterson have a "choice"? Do soccer moms want LIBERAL judges + Kobe Bryant + O.J.? WOMEN of the world unite! LIBERAL Demon-KKK-Rat John KKKerry opposes the death penalty, he supports rights for dirty muslim terrorists and criminals, and he promises to appoint LIBERAL judges to the U.S. Supreme Court. By contrast, President George W. Bush and the Party of Lincoln support the death penalty and support TOUGH JUDGES who protect women’s rights to be free from rape, murder, assault, battery, and terrorism. Please protect our sisters, daughters and mothers: vote Bush/Cheney! Don’t bother reporting rape: LIBERAL judges don’t care Why Hillary Clinton is an inspiration for all women Hillary stands by her girly-man who is a: + dis-barred lawyer + serial adulterer + serial perjurer and liar + dirty old bastard who preys upon females the same age as his daughter Feminists Silent on Freedom for Iraqi Women by Lisa De Pasquale http://www.cblpolicyinstitute.org/silenceoniraqiwomen.htm The transfer of sovereignty to the Iraqi government marks a new day for Iraqi women. Thanks to the courageous action taken by the Bush administration and its allies, Iraqi women have renewed freedom. The administration has insisted that women receive educational and small business opportunities, as well as active participation in government. For months radical feminists have been silent on the plight of Iraqi women. Instead this hypocritical bunch has condemned the war in Iraq and its subsequent liberation of women simply because the war is supported by conservatives. In March feminists gathered in front of the White House to protest military action against Saddam Hussein. The protest was called "Code Pink: Women’s Pre-Emptive Strike for Peace." On the other side of the world, Iraqi women were being denied the most basic (Indian)n lived in fear knowing that Iraqi law freely allowed male relatives to murder them in the name of honor. In Iraqi prisons, women were raped and tortured for being related to Iraqi opposition activists. Videotapes of the acts were sent to the families. Despite obvious human rights violations and limits on freedom, feminists, led by the National Organization for Women, ignored Saddam Hussein’s reprehensible treatment of women. Under the Saddam Hussein regime Iraqi women were not allowed to work outside the home. Feminists, on the other hand, talked about America’s "tyrants" and the threat of "tyranny in our homes, our workplaces and our schools." Radical feminists witnessed a legitimate case of tyranny and violence against women in Iraq, but they remained steadfastly against policies and actions taken by America and the Bush administration that helped these women. NOW President Kim Gandy stated, "The real terrorism is the Bush administration’s disregard for international law and destruction of civil liberties at home. This has become an issue of one dictator versus another." Feminists are more comfortable allowing Iraqi women to endure torture than supporting the Bush Administration. For example, a report by Amnesty International documented the beheading of 50 young women in Baghdad. The report also said, "The heads of these women were hung on the doors of their houses for a few days." Saddam’s son Uday led the group of men who beheaded the women and terrorized their families. The US State Department reports that human rights organizations receive continuous testimony on the psychological trauma women have suffered after being tortured and raped by Iraqi military personnel. Despite this overwhelming evidence, feminists in the US praised Iraq and cited a suspicious United Nations report that said Iraq "scored highest in women’s empowerment." Before the capture of Saddam, NOW stated in a press release posted on their website that Iraqi women "currently enjoy more rights and freedoms than women in other Gulf nations, such as Saudi Arabia." At an International Alliance for Justice press conference in 2002, Safia al-Souhail, an Iraqi woman whose father was murdered for opposing Saddam, said, "We are here begging the support of the free world to liberate us from the nightmare we have been living in for the past three decades." Al-Souhail also said, "Disarmament alone will not end our suffering. This regime should be indicted for its crimes against humanity." NOW and their cohorts were deaf to these women’s pleas and still condemn the war in Iraq. Feminists invent problems in the US and ignore the real problems faced by women around the world. NOW accuses President Bush of "reversing women’s rights here and abroad." Feminist Majority leader Eleanor Smeal odiously said that the Bush Administration "needs to construct a foreign policy as if women mattered." The deceptively titled March for Women’s Lives in April brought thousands of feminists and leftist supporters to Washington, DC. Rather than march against the atrocities and violence against women in Iraq and other countries around the world, feminists waved coat hangers and demanded taxpayer-funded abortions. Cybill Shepherd held a sign that said, "Too bad John Ashcroft’s mother didn’t believe in abortion." Amid "Fire Bush," "Tarts for Choice" and other placards feminist icon Gloria Steinem told the crowd, "This government is the greatest danger on earth!" Echoing the hateful and hysterical rhetoric, Senator Hillary Clinton, with no apparent sense of irony regarding the previous administration, said she was there to criticize President Bush for "not upholding laws against sexual harassment and discrimination." These radical feminists’ stance on military action in Iraq and the global war on terrorism illustrate how they have consistently fallen short of their purported mission to "eliminate sexism and eliminate all oppression." Their motives are clearly political and not based on advancing the rights of women around the world. When faced with a war that liberated the Iraqi people, a majority of whom are women, feminists would much rather turn a blind eye to the horrors of Saddam than support America and the Bush Administration.

Response:

Water Challenge Time!

Question:

Starting tomorrow (Monday 8/29), post your results (goal/actual) at the end of the day. Jenn

Oh, sounds like a good idea. I’d like to participate. How long does it last? — PL (320/298/170) (First mini-goal: 299 Reached! 08/26/04) (Second mini-goal: 279) — Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

Response:

Ok folks, this was a great idea in the past and it’s time to resurrect it. For those who are new or didn’t pay attention last time – a water challenge is *not* who can drink the most water.  It is a way for you to set a goal for yourself, a healthy one, and try to meet it one day at a time.  Most experts recommended that we drink at least 64 oz. of water per day for a multitude of reasons though many of us do find it helps with weight loss too.  However, a number of us find we let this go while working on our healthy WOE.  The purpose of this challenge is to bring your attention to how much water you are drinking. Participation is completely voluntary.  If you think this is an "insane" idea then just go play with yourself and leave the rest of us alone. Starting tomorrow (Monday 8/29), post your results (goal/actual) at the end of the day. Jenn

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Lictor Well, no one is advocating that a person drink a few gallons except for one anonymous poster who appears to be trolling. That was who I was responding to, and his suggestion that obese people should drink "several gallons" a day. You never know what people might try when they read advice like that… I’m not denying that drinking enough water is indeed a good thing (though one should be cautious with *miniral* water). I agree. Under normal conditions, thirst is a good enough indicator for keeping oneself properly hydrated. Thirst is a poor indicator according to this and many other articles. There are so many benefits to keeping properly hydrated – why wait until you’re thirsty? http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0675/is_4_20/ai_90924144 Thank you for an interesting article. Kleiner made up her own definition of "mild dehydration", as being loss of 1-2% of body weight as fluid. The nationally acceptable definition is 3-5%. http://www.who.int/water_sanitation_health/diseases/wsh0302/en/index2… i

In addition to helping with constipation, drinking enough water each day might also relieve anal retention. Jenn

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ok folks, this was a great idea in the past and it’s time to resurrect it. For those who are new or didn’t pay attention last time – a water challenge is *not* who can drink the most water.  It is a way for you to set a goal for yourself, a healthy one, and try to meet it one day at a time. Most experts recommended that we drink at least 64 oz. of water per day for a multitude of reasons though many of us do find it helps with weight loss too.  However, a number of us find we let this go while working on our healthy WOE.  The purpose of this challenge is to bring your attention to how much water you are drinking. Participation is completely voluntary.  If you think this is an "insane" idea then just go play with yourself and leave the rest of us alone. Starting tomorrow (Monday 8/29), post your results (goal/actual) at the end of the day. Jenn

I’m in Jenn Susan 280/187/140

Response:

yea, but still, the more, the better. Of course if you only have 5 pounds to lose 64oz might do it, but if you have 50, try a few gallons.

Response:

yea, but still, the more, the better. Of course if you only have 5 pounds to lose 64oz might do it, but if you have 50, try a few gallons.

I’m not sure there’s much of a correlation between how much you have to lose and how much you should drink.  The body can’t use more water than it needs. I’ve lost 120 lbs., and I’m sure I’ve rarely drunk more than 64 oz. per day. Chris 262/141/ (145-150)

Response:

Count me in.  I’ve been having a problem drinking enough water.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ok folks, this was a great idea in the past and it’s time to resurrect it. For those who are new or didn’t pay attention last time – a water challenge is *not* who can drink the most water.  It is a way for you to set a goal for yourself, a healthy one, and try to meet it one day at a time.  Most experts recommended that we drink at least 64 oz. of water per day for a multitude of reasons though many of us do find it helps with weight loss too.  However, a number of us find we let this go while working on our healthy WOE.  The purpose of this challenge is to bring your attention to how much water you are drinking. Participation is completely voluntary.  If you think this is an "insane" idea then just go play with yourself and leave the rest of us alone. Starting tomorrow (Monday 8/29), post your results (goal/actual) at the end of the day. Jenn

Response:

Starting tomorrow (Monday 8/29), post your results (goal/actual) at the end of the day. Jenn Oh, sounds like a good idea. I’d like to participate. How long does it last?

Normally we’ll go a week, like the pedometer challenge and other interesting stuff people come up with. It’s meant to be fun, so please do try to enjoy it and don’t feel bad if you don’t reach your goals on a given day. The intention is to just bring awareness. Happy sipping! Jenn

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well, no one is advocating that a person drink a few gallons except for one anonymous poster who appears to be trolling. That was who I was responding to, and his suggestion that obese people should drink "several gallons" a day. You never know what people might try when they read advice like that… I’m not denying that drinking enough water is indeed a good thing (though one should be cautious with *miniral* water). I agree. Under normal conditions, thirst is a good enough indicator for keeping oneself properly hydrated.

Thirst is a poor indicator according to this and many other articles.  There are so many benefits to keeping properly hydrated – why wait until you’re thirsty? http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0675/is_4_20/ai_90924144 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – http://www.nutritionaustralia.org/Food_Facts/FAQ/optimal_hydration_fa… “For most people, thirst is a pretty good indicator of the need to drink (although it isn’t perfect in all situations, as described in detail below). For people who do not readily experience thirst, other relevant indicators include infrequent urination, low volume and dark colour of urine. If you do not have to urinate every few hours, and the urine you produce is much darker than usual, you have probably started to dehydrate.” “For most people water is the most appropriate rehydration fluid under all but exceptional circumstances.” So, drinking water when thirsty, should work… With some obvious exceptions, see above. i

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ok folks, this was a great idea in the past and it’s time to resurrect it. For those who are new or didn’t pay attention last time – a water challenge is *not* who can drink the most water.  It is a way for you to set a goal for yourself, a healthy one, and try to meet it one day at a time.  Most experts recommended that we drink at least 64 oz. of water per day for a multitude of reasons though many of us do find it helps with weight loss too.  However, a number of us find we let this go while working on our healthy WOE.  The purpose of this challenge is to bring your attention to how much water you are drinking. Participation is completely voluntary.  If you think this is an "insane" idea then just go play with yourself and leave the rest of us alone. Starting tomorrow (Monday 8/29), post your results (goal/actual) at the end of the day. Jenn

I should join in.  Although right now I’m 1/2 way thru a 1 liter bottle and I’m also fighting an allergy/cold that has decided to attack my throat this morning.  I’m finding drinking water is not very soothing. Lately I’ve been drinking too much diet soda and not enough water.   I really need to change that. I also like the old drinking game we once had on ASD.   Anytime you read a post with the word Water in it, you drink.

Response:

Ok folks, this was a great idea in the past and it’s time to resurrect it. For those who are new or didn’t pay attention last time – a water challenge is *not* who can drink the most water.  It is a way for you to set a goal for yourself, a healthy one, and try to meet it one day at a time.

This is one I could go for…

Response:

Well, no one is advocating that a person drink a few gallons except for one anonymous poster who appears to be trolling.

That was who I was responding to, and his suggestion that obese people should drink "several gallons" a day. You never know what people might try when they read advice like that… I’m not denying that drinking enough water is indeed a good thing (though one should be cautious with *miniral* water).

Response:

I’m not sure there’s much of a correlation between how much you have to lose and how much you should drink.  The body can’t use more water than it needs. Besides, it is possible to drink *too much* water, just as it is possible not to drink enough… A "few gallons" of low minerals water while not eating much can bring electrolyte unbalance, and this is certainly not healthy. A few gallons of high mineral water can also lead to unbalance or other problems (nitrates, sodium…).

Well, no one is advocating that a person drink a few gallons except for one anonymous poster who appears to be trolling.  One half  to one gallon a day will generally do no harm to the majority of people but will have a number of postive effects on the body.  Weight loss is a potential side effect, but not necessarily though a recent study did find that it really may help by making you feel fuller: http://tinyurl.com/3sd8g "The researchers estimate that over the course of a year, a person who increases his water consumption by 1.5 liters a day would burn an extra 17,400 calories, for a weight loss of approximately five pounds. They note that up to 40% of the increase in calorie burning is caused by the body’s attempt to heat the ingested water. The findings are reported in the December issue of The Journal of Clinical Endocrinology and Metabolism. " It also may help prevent heart attacks: http://tinyurl.com/4kupl Researchers say when people drink water it is absorbed quickly and easily into the bloodstream and thins the blood — helping to prevent artery-clogging clots. But other liquids require digestion, which may require fluids to move from the blood into the gut — creating a blood-thickening effect. Don’t forget the positive effects it has on digestion (relieving or preventing constipation), skin, and other organs.  I could go on ad infinitum on the postive effects of drinking plenty of water, but I won’t. Jenn can also pull out studies to make a case

Response:

I’m not sure there’s much of a correlation between how much you have to lose and how much you should drink.  The body can’t use more water than it needs.

Besides, it is possible to drink *too much* water, just as it is possible not to drink enough… A "few gallons" of low minerals water while not eating much can bring electrolyte unbalance, and this is certainly not healthy. A few gallons of high mineral water can also lead to unbalance or other problems (nitrates, sodium…).

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Lictor Well, no one is advocating that a person drink a few gallons except for one anonymous poster who appears to be trolling. That was who I was responding to, and his suggestion that obese people should drink "several gallons" a day. You never know what people might try when they read advice like that… I’m not denying that drinking enough water is indeed a good thing (though one should be cautious with *miniral* water). I agree. Under normal conditions, thirst is a good enough indicator for keeping oneself properly hydrated. Thirst is a poor indicator according to this and many other articles. There are so many benefits to keeping properly hydrated – why wait until you’re thirsty? http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0675/is_4_20/ai_90924144 Thank you for an interesting article. Kleiner made up her own definition of "mild dehydration", as being loss of 1-2% of body weight as fluid. The nationally acceptable definition is 3-5%. http://www.who.int/water_sanitation_health/diseases/wsh0302/en/index2…

If you don’t want to participate then don’t… geez who cares about all of the reasons why you don’t want to participate? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – i

Response:

In addition to helping with constipation, drinking enough water each day might also relieve anal retention. Jenn

<snort Since I just finished off my 1liter bottle of water, I almost pee’d my pants reading this one.  :) Usually I’m spitting diet coke at the screen, but by drinking more water and less soda, its a matter of bladder control now.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ok folks, this was a great idea in the past and it’s time to resurrect it. For those who are new or didn’t pay attention last time – a water challenge is *not* who can drink the most water.  It is a way for you to set a goal for yourself, a healthy one, and try to meet it one day at a time.  Most experts recommended that we drink at least 64 oz. of water per day for a multitude of reasons though many of us do find it helps with weight loss too.  However, a number of us find we let this go while working on our healthy WOE.  The purpose of this challenge is to bring your attention to how much water you are drinking. Participation is completely voluntary.  If you think this is an "insane" idea then just go play with yourself and leave the rest of us alone. Starting tomorrow (Monday 8/29), post your results (goal/actual) at the end of the day. Jenn I should join in.  Although right now I’m 1/2 way thru a 1 liter bottle and I’m also fighting an allergy/cold that has decided to attack my throat this morning.  I’m finding drinking water is not very soothing. Lately I’ve been drinking too much diet soda and not enough water.   I really need to change that. I also like the old drinking game we once had on ASD.   Anytime you read a post with the word Water in it, you drink.

LOL, that’s what works for me!  I’m not counting, I’m just drinking every time I get up to pee, as well as anytime it occurs to me. I also like to start out the day with two full glasses of water.  I’m doing another "Body for Life" challenge and a nick-name we’ve got for that is "Potty for Life" because of all the water we drink. Dally

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Lictor Well, no one is advocating that a person drink a few gallons except for one anonymous poster who appears to be trolling. That was who I was responding to, and his suggestion that obese people should drink "several gallons" a day. You never know what people might try when they read advice like that… I’m not denying that drinking enough water is indeed a good thing (though one should be cautious with *miniral* water). I agree. Under normal conditions, thirst is a good enough indicator for keeping oneself properly hydrated. Thirst is a poor indicator according to this and many other articles. There are so many benefits to keeping properly hydrated – why wait until you’re thirsty? http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0675/is_4_20/ai_90924144 Thank you for an interesting article. Kleiner made up her own definition of "mild dehydration", as being loss of 1-2% of body weight as fluid. The nationally acceptable definition is 3-5%. http://www.who.int/water_sanitation_health/diseases/wsh0302/en/index2… If you don’t want to participate then don’t… geez who cares about all of the reasons why you don’t want to participate? He did the same thing last time we had a water challenge.  I really don’t give a damn about the definition of dehydration – I just want to remember to drink plenty of water!

He’s still trying to prove that he’s right and we’re somehow "insane" as he called it before…gee, wonder who the insane one is here?  Since it’s not something he practices and probably because I’m involved, he needs to try and piss on our parade.  BFD.  For every study he’s produced, we’ve produced others.  Let him play his game because all it does is show what a nitpick know-it-all he is. Yes, this is so we pay attention to how much water we’re drinking, a healthy habit.  Maybe instead it should be a saturated fat challenge?

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Lictor Well, no one is advocating that a person drink a few gallons except for one anonymous poster who appears to be trolling. That was who I was responding to, and his suggestion that obese people should drink "several gallons" a day. You never know what people might try when they read advice like that… I’m not denying that drinking enough water is indeed a good thing (though one should be cautious with *miniral* water). I agree. Under normal conditions, thirst is a good enough indicator for keeping oneself properly hydrated. Thirst is a poor indicator according to this and many other articles. There are so many benefits to keeping properly hydrated – why wait until you’re thirsty? http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0675/is_4_20/ai_90924144 Thank you for an interesting article. Kleiner made up her own definition of "mild dehydration", as being loss of 1-2% of body weight as fluid. The nationally acceptable definition is 3-5%.

http://www.who.int/water_sanitation_health/diseases/wsh0302/en/index2… If you don’t want to participate then don’t… geez who cares about all of the reasons why you don’t want to participate?

He did the same thing last time we had a water challenge.  I really don’t give a damn about the definition of dehydration – I just want to remember to drink plenty of water!

Response:

I was wondering how things were going for you.  Hope to see you posting more often. Beverly

When things are more straightened out here, I might have time. But right now, not much time for the computer at all. However, have my water bottle in hand this morning, though slightly marred after the cat tried to chomp the straw the other night. Cynthia 262/236.0/225

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – <snip healthy WOE.  The purpose of this challenge is to bring your attention to how much water you are drinking. Participation is completely voluntary.  If you think this is an "insane" idea then just go play with yourself and leave the rest of us alone. Starting tomorrow (Monday 8/29), post your results (goal/actual) at the end of the day. I’ll try to be in, though I haven’t been reading lately! But, I *am* painting my living room and it has been a huge chore as much of the walls need repair before painting. I’m definitely not drinking enough and I feel it. So anything to make me think about drinking more is good. I haven’t been eating right lately either, so maybe getting back to my water will help with that. Cynthia 262/236.0/225 I was wondering how things were going for you.  Hope to see you posting more often. Beverly

Hi Cynthia – I’m piggybacking as I didn’t even see this message in the original (I don’t have you killfield, honest!). Glad to see your post here – hope things are going OK in general for you and George. janice

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – <snip healthy WOE.  The purpose of this challenge is to bring your attention to how much water you are drinking. Participation is completely voluntary.  If you think this is an "insane" idea then just go play with yourself and leave the rest of us alone. Starting tomorrow (Monday 8/29), post your results (goal/actual) at the end of the day. I’ll try to be in, though I haven’t been reading lately! But, I *am* painting my living room and it has been a huge chore as much of the walls need repair before painting. I’m definitely not drinking enough and I feel it. So anything to make me think about drinking more is good. I haven’t been eating right lately either, so maybe getting back to my water will help with that. Cynthia 262/236.0/225

I was wondering how things were going for you.  Hope to see you posting more often. Beverly

Response:

<snip healthy WOE.  The purpose of this challenge is to bring your attention to how much water you are drinking. Participation is completely voluntary.  If you think this is an "insane" idea then just go play with yourself and leave the rest of us alone. Starting tomorrow (Monday 8/29), post your results (goal/actual) at the end of the day.

I’ll try to be in, though I haven’t been reading lately! But, I *am* painting my living room and it has been a huge chore as much of the walls need repair before painting. I’m definitely not drinking enough and I feel it. So anything to make me think about drinking more is good. I haven’t been eating right lately either, so maybe getting back to my water will help with that. Cynthia 262/236.0/225

Response:

I also like to start out the day with two full glasses of water.  I’m doing another "Body for Life" challenge and a nick-name we’ve got for that is "Potty for Life" because of all the water we drink.

LOL! My co-workers probably think I’ve contracted some sort of exotic disease considering how often I run to the bathroom. — PL (320/298/170) (First mini-goal: 299 Reached! 08/26/04) (Second mini-goal: 279) — Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – message Lictor Well, no one is advocating that a person drink a few gallons except for one anonymous poster who appears to be trolling. That was who I was responding to, and his suggestion that obese people should drink "several gallons" a day. You never know what people might try when they read advice like that… I’m not denying that drinking enough water is indeed a good thing (though one should be cautious with *miniral* water). I agree. Under normal conditions, thirst is a good enough indicator for keeping oneself properly hydrated. Thirst is a poor indicator according to this and many other articles. There are so many benefits to keeping properly hydrated – why wait until you’re thirsty? http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0675/is_4_20/ai_90924144 Thank you for an interesting article. Kleiner made up her own definition of "mild dehydration", as being loss of 1-2% of body weight as fluid. The nationally acceptable definition is 3-5%.

http://www.who.int/water_sanitation_health/diseases/wsh0302/en/index2… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If you don’t want to participate then don’t… geez who cares about all of the reasons why you don’t want to participate? He did the same thing last time we had a water challenge.  I really don’t give a damn about the definition of dehydration – I just want to remember to drink plenty of water! He’s still trying to prove that he’s right and we’re somehow "insane" as he called it before…gee, wonder who the insane one is here?  Since it’s not something he practices and probably because I’m involved, he needs to try and piss on our parade.  BFD.  For every study he’s produced, we’ve produced others.  Let him play his game because all it does is show what a nitpick know-it-all he is. Yes, this is so we pay attention to how much water we’re drinking, a healthy habit.  Maybe instead it should be a saturated fat challenge?

No joke.  I mean who gives a flying f*ck about why he doesn’t want to do this. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

It’s that time again!  Time to take a few days and focus on a healthy habit.  Drinking enough water every day is important to a number of body functions and has been shown anecdotally to assist with weight loss in some people. Here’s a little water tidbit: "The human brain is composed of 95% water; blood is 82% water; the lungs are nearly 90% water. How important is this composition? A mere 2% drop in body water can trigger fuzzy short-term memory, trouble with basic math, and difficulty focusing on the computer screen or on a printed page. Mild dehydration is also one of the most common causes of daytime fatigue." http://health.yahoo.com/ate/drdonnica/alldaily/2003/10/00025549 For those unfamiliar with the challenge it works like this – you set a reasonable goal for yourself each day and try to meet it. It is NOT a contest to see who can drink the most water. You post how you did each evening (accountability). Those interested in participating – we’ll start Monday.  Those who do not wish to participate, don’t need to – it’s just that simple. Happy sipping! Jenn

Response:

It’s that time again!  Time to take a few days and focus on a healthy habit.  Drinking enough water every day is important to a number of body functions and has been shown anecdotally to assist with weight loss in some people.

And mark your calendars for pedometer challenge the following week.  I just wanted to mention that now because Target has pedometers on sale for $7.99 this week (http://tinyurl.com/5lwmc). — jmk in NC

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s that time again!  Time to take a few days and focus on a healthy habit.  Drinking enough water every day is important to a number of body functions and has been shown anecdotally to assist with weight loss in some people. Here’s a little water tidbit: "The human brain is composed of 95% water; blood is 82% water; the lungs are nearly 90% water. How important is this composition? A mere 2% drop in body water can trigger fuzzy short-term memory, trouble with basic math, and difficulty focusing on the computer screen or on a printed page. Mild dehydration is also one of the most common causes of daytime fatigue." http://health.yahoo.com/ate/drdonnica/alldaily/2003/10/00025549 For those unfamiliar with the challenge it works like this – you set a reasonable goal for yourself each day and try to meet it. It is NOT a contest to see who can drink the most water. You post how you did each evening (accountability). Those interested in participating – we’ll start Monday.  Those who do not wish to participate, don’t need to – it’s just that simple. Happy sipping! Jenn

I read recently (sorry can’t quote the source) that this business of forcing down water is not necessary. — Diva ***** The Best Man For The Job Is A Woman

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – JMA It’s that time again!  Time to take a few days and focus on a healthy habit.  Drinking enough water every day is important to a number of body functions and has been shown anecdotally to assist with weight loss in some people. Here’s a little water tidbit: "The human brain is composed of 95% water; blood is 82% water; the lungs are nearly 90% water. How important is this composition? A mere 2% drop in body water can trigger fuzzy short-term memory, trouble with basic math, and difficulty focusing on the computer screen or on a printed page. Mild dehydration is also one of the most common causes of daytime fatigue." http://health.yahoo.com/ate/drdonnica/alldaily/2003/10/00025549 For those unfamiliar with the challenge it works like this – you set a reasonable goal for yourself each day and try to meet it. It is NOT a contest to see who can drink the most water. You post how you did each evening (accountability). Those interested in participating – we’ll start Monday.  Those who do not wish to participate, don’t need to – it’s just that simple. Happy sipping! Jenn I read recently (sorry can’t quote the source) that this business of forcing down water is not necessary.

There are differing opinions on the subject.  Most go in favor of staying reasonably hydrated – including Mayo Clinic who I trust more than most sources out there as they’ve had my life in their hands more than once. http://tinyurl.com/285mq No one is asking anyone to force down anything.  Obviously if it’s a chore then it’s probably a good idea not to participate.  There are people in this group that have found it helpful and find that drinking plenty of water helps them feel better, helps with weight loss, skin, etc. From personal experience I know that if I drink a lot of water (approx

80-100 oz.) through the day I lift better at the gym, heavier weights with less effort.  It’s not as scientific as running a low carb half marathon at a 60 yr. old woman’s WAVA, but it’s enough for me personally to know it’s right for me. Jenn

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – JMA It’s that time again!  Time to take a few days and focus on a healthy habit.  Drinking enough water every day is important to a number of body functions and has been shown anecdotally to assist with weight loss in some people. Here’s a little water tidbit: "The human brain is composed of 95% water; blood is 82% water; the lungs are nearly 90% water. How important is this composition? A mere 2% drop in body water can trigger fuzzy short-term memory, trouble with basic math, and difficulty focusing on the computer screen or on a printed page. Mild dehydration is also one of the most common causes of daytime fatigue." http://health.yahoo.com/ate/drdonnica/alldaily/2003/10/00025549 For those unfamiliar with the challenge it works like this – you set a reasonable goal for yourself each day and try to meet it. It is NOT a contest to see who can drink the most water. You post how you did each evening (accountability). Those interested in participating – we’ll start Monday.  Those who do not wish to participate, don’t need to – it’s just that simple. Happy sipping! Jenn I read recently (sorry can’t quote the source) that this business of forcing down water is not necessary. There are differing opinions on the subject.  Most go in favor of staying reasonably hydrated – including Mayo Clinic who I trust more than most sources out there as they’ve had my life in their hands more than once. http://tinyurl.com/285mq No one is asking anyone to force down anything.  Obviously if it’s a chore then it’s probably a good idea not to participate.  There are people in this group that have found it helpful and find that drinking plenty of water helps them feel better, helps with weight loss, skin, etc. From personal experience I know that if I drink a lot of water (approx 80-100 oz.) through the day I lift better at the gym, heavier weights with less effort.  It’s not as scientific as running a low carb half marathon at a 60 yr. old woman’s WAVA, but it’s enough for me personally to know it’s right for me. Jenn

I know that one of the key pieces of health advice I was given before being posted to Iraq was "pee clear twice a day".  In some ways it was easier to do that in Baghdad where there were bottles of water everywhere for us than back at home. I’m trying though. Rachael

Response:

<snip Those interested in participating – we’ll start Monday.  Those who do not wish to participate, don’t need to – it’s just that simple. Happy sipping!

Water is my main drink anyway, so I won’t be participating, but more power to those of you that do! I’m getting thirsty just thinking about it… —     J.J. in WA * 275/234 Goal #2: 215 By Dec 31 ‘05 Goal #3: 195 by May 31 ‘05

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – <snip Those interested in participating – we’ll start Monday.  Those who do not wish to participate, don’t need to – it’s just that simple. Happy sipping! Water is my main drink anyway, so I won’t be participating, but more power to those of you that do! I’m getting thirsty just thinking about it… —    J.J. in WA * 275/234 Goal #2: 215 By Dec 31 ‘05 Goal #3: 195 by May 31 ‘05

I’ve sadly been slipping into the coffee void since heading back to work and dealing with 12 hr days.  I need to get myself back on track! Jenn

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – JMA It’s that time again!  Time to take a few days and focus on a healthy habit.  Drinking enough water every day is important to a number of body functions and has been shown anecdotally to assist with weight loss in some people. Here’s a little water tidbit: "The human brain is composed of 95% water; blood is 82% water; the lungs are nearly 90% water. How important is this composition? A mere 2% drop in body water can trigger fuzzy short-term memory, trouble with basic math, and difficulty focusing on the computer screen or on a printed page. Mild dehydration is also one of the most common causes of daytime fatigue." http://health.yahoo.com/ate/drdonnica/alldaily/2003/10/00025549 For those unfamiliar with the challenge it works like this – you set a reasonable goal for yourself each day and try to meet it. It is NOT a contest to see who can drink the most water. You post how you did each evening (accountability). Those interested in participating – we’ll start Monday.  Those who do not wish to participate, don’t need to – it’s just that simple. Happy sipping! Jenn I read recently (sorry can’t quote the source) that this business of forcing down water is not necessary. There are differing opinions on the subject.  Most go in favor of staying reasonably hydrated – including Mayo Clinic who I trust more than most sources out there as they’ve had my life in their hands more than once. http://tinyurl.com/285mq No one is asking anyone to force down anything.  Obviously if it’s a chore then it’s probably a good idea not to participate.  There are people in this group that have found it helpful and find that drinking plenty of water helps them feel better, helps with weight loss, skin, etc. From personal experience I know that if I drink a lot of water (approx 80-100 oz.) through the day I lift better at the gym, heavier weights with less effort.  It’s not as scientific as running a low carb half marathon at a 60 yr. old woman’s WAVA, but it’s enough for me personally to know it’s right for me. Jenn I know that one of the key pieces of health advice I was given before being posted to Iraq was "pee clear twice a day".  In some ways it was easier to do that in Baghdad where there were bottles of water everywhere for us than back at home. I’m trying though. Rachael

Rachael, If I were posted to Iraq, I’d be peeing every five minutes. The only comfort, and a small one at that, is knowing there were never weapons of mass destruction after all!. The Pres says he is not buying that even though the committee that reported it is with his administration. — Diva ***** The Best Man For The Job Is A Woman

Response:

yea, bad habit … I only drink out of this 1/2 gallon jug so I tend to drink lots and lots of water at once when I choose to get a draink … it’s hard going through the day with just 2 or 3 drinks of water, but for me that’s a gallon and some … and I still dehydrate … and if I start drinking 4 or 5 gallons like I did before I’ll start eating bad again …  bad habit indeed … I can’t seem to overcome thinking all the other drink glasses around the house are dirty, especially ones my dad has used before … need help, I guess …

Response:

Mild dehydration is also one of the most common causes of daytime fatigue.

I heard this back when I was taking naps every afternoon and was able to give them up by drinking more water.  This was before I ever decided to lose weight.  Naps are lovely on occasion but I didn’t want to sleep my life away. — On the bike . . . Laurie in Maine 207/110  60 inches of attitude! Start: 2/02  Maintained since 2/03

Response:

If I were posted to Iraq, I’d be peeing every five minutes. — Diva ***** The Best Man For The Job Is A Woman

Not if you’d seen the toilets you wouldn’t! Rachael

Response:

I’ve had days I drank no water as well as days I drank ten gallons … so the "right" or "good" amount must be somewhere in between !!! lol …

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I read recently (sorry can’t quote the source) that this business of forcing down water is not necessary. Who’s forcing? Let’s say I drink one cup of water and are not thirsty, meaning I do not want any more water. Then, because of some external considerations (for example, a USENET "hydration" challenge going on), not because of thirst, I drink an extra cup. That’s forcing (of that one extra cup).

No one is forcing you to drink that extra cup.  Since you’re not participating in our water challenge why even worry about it?  Your negative comments are not welcome nor very supportive of those who do choose to participate in the different challenges in the group. Beverly

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I read recently (sorry can’t quote the source) that this business of forcing down water is not necessary. Who’s forcing? Let’s say I drink one cup of water and are not thirsty, meaning I do not want any more water. Then, because of some external considerations (for example, a USENET "hydration" challenge going on), not because of thirst, I drink an extra cup. That’s forcing (of that one extra cup). So, if I drink water to my heart’s content, as much as I want, then it is not forcing, but drinking more than that is "forcing". That’s my understanding. i

Oh, wait, drinking a healthy amount of water is bad in spite of the multitude of resources in favor of it, however, becoming anorexic to reduce your chances of breast cancer is good. This is why drama queens like you should not participate.  No one is advocating that anyone do anything unhealthy, bizarre, or fringe, but because you are so much of a wuss that you get "nauseous" from drinking water, you have to flaunt your ignorance and act like you are being coerced. If you are so goddamn brainless that you are so easily swayed by a simple usenet suggestion, I suggest you find another hobby. Get a life dipshit. Jenn

Response:

I read recently (sorry can’t quote the source) that this business of forcing down water is not necessary.

Who’s forcing? — On the bike . . . Laurie in Maine 207/110  60 inches of attitude! Start: 2/02  Maintained since 2/03

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I read recently (sorry can’t quote the source) that this business of forcing down water is not necessary. Who’s forcing? Let’s say I drink one cup of water and are not thirsty, meaning I do not want any more water. Then, because of some external considerations (for example, a USENET "hydration" challenge going on), not because of thirst, I drink an extra cup. That’s forcing (of that one extra cup). No one is forcing you to drink that extra cup.  Since you’re not participating in our water challenge why even worry about it?  Your negative comments are not welcome nor very supportive of those who do choose to participate in the different challenges in the group. I was answering a question about what’s "forcing". I do not participate in this water challenge because I drink enough not to be thirsty, without any challenges, and see no reason to drink any more beyond that. Of course, as a free individual, you can choose to drink more than your sense of thirst tells you, or just enough, or even less! i Beverly

We all know the definition of force.  It isn’t necessary for you to give us your version. I’m glad you drink enough water but for those of us who often neglect to drink enough the challenges often get us back into the healthy habit of drinking sufficient water. Why do you feel the need to even post in these challenge threads when you don’t choose to participate?  You constantly make negative remarks about these challenges.  As I said before, if you can’t be supportive then you might show a little consideration for others in the group and keep these comments to yourself.  As I said before, they’re not supportive and are now welcome. Beverly

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I read recently (sorry can’t quote the source) that this business of forcing down water is not necessary. Who’s forcing? Let’s say I drink one cup of water and are not thirsty, meaning I do not want any more water. Then, because of some external considerations (for example, a USENET "hydration" challenge going on), not because of thirst, I drink an extra cup. That’s forcing (of that one extra cup). No one is forcing you to drink that extra cup.  Since you’re not participating in our water challenge why even worry about it?  Your negative comments are not welcome nor very supportive of those who do choose to participate in the different challenges in the group. Beverly

We’re doing something he doesn’t do so therefore we’re wrong and he has to be right at all times due to his pathological nature.  Since he doesn’t do this and therefore isn’t participating, there isn’t any way for him to get attention except to put it down. Jenn

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – message SnugBear I read recently (sorry can’t quote the source) that this business of forcing down water is not necessary. Who’s forcing? Let’s say I drink one cup of water and are not thirsty, meaning I do not want any more water. Then, because of some external considerations (for example, a USENET "hydration" challenge going on), not because of thirst, I drink an extra cup. That’s forcing (of that one extra cup). No one is forcing you to drink that extra cup.  Since you’re not participating in our water challenge why even worry about it?  Your negative comments are not welcome nor very supportive of those who do choose to participate in the different challenges in the group. I was answering a question about what’s "forcing". I do not participate in this water challenge because I drink enough not to be thirsty, without any challenges, and see no reason to drink any more beyond that. Of course, as a free individual, you can choose to drink more than your sense of thirst tells you, or just enough, or even less! i Beverly We all know the definition of force.  It isn’t necessary for you to give us your version. I’m glad you drink enough water but for those of us who often neglect to drink enough the challenges often get us back into the healthy habit of drinking sufficient water. Why do you feel the need to even post in these challenge threads when you don’t choose to participate?  You constantly make negative remarks about these challenges.  As I said before, if you can’t be supportive then you might show a little consideration for others in the group and keep these comments to yourself.  As I said before, they’re not supportive and are now welcome. Beverly

Oops!  That should be "not welcome" and not "now welcome".

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – message SnugBear I read recently (sorry can’t quote the source) that this business of forcing down water is not necessary. Who’s forcing? Let’s say I drink one cup of water and are not thirsty, meaning I do not want any more water. Then, because of some external considerations (for example, a USENET "hydration" challenge going on), not because of thirst, I drink an extra cup. That’s forcing (of that one extra cup). No one is forcing you to drink that extra cup.  Since you’re not participating in our water challenge why even worry about it?  Your negative comments are not welcome nor very supportive of those who do choose to participate in the different challenges in the group. I was answering a question about what’s "forcing". I do not participate in this water challenge because I drink enough not to be thirsty, without any challenges, and see no reason to drink any more beyond that. Of course, as a free individual, you can choose to drink more than your sense of thirst tells you, or just enough, or even less! We all know the definition of force.  It isn’t necessary for you to give us your version. Let’s see, Carol said "this business of forcing down water is not necessary." Then SnugBear asked, "Who’s forcing?" Which was exactly the question that I answered.

I believe SnugBear was addressing Carol. I’m glad you drink enough water but for those of us who often neglect to drink enough the challenges often get us back into the healthy habit of drinking sufficient water. Why do you feel the need to even post in these challenge threads when you don’t choose to participate? Other individuals also do not participate in this challenge and posted to this thread. i

Again you’ve neglected to answer the question.  When I want to know why the others posted to this thread I’ll ask them<g Beverly

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I read recently (sorry can’t quote the source) that this business of forcing down water is not necessary. Who’s forcing? Let’s say I drink one cup of water and are not thirsty, meaning I do not want any more water. Then, because of some external considerations (for example, a USENET "hydration" challenge going on), not because of thirst, I drink an extra cup. That’s forcing (of that one extra cup). No one is forcing you to drink that extra cup.  Since you’re not participating in our water challenge why even worry about it?  Your negative comments are not welcome nor very supportive of those who do choose to participate in the different challenges in the group. I was answering a question about what’s "forcing". I do not participate in this water challenge because I drink enough not to be thirsty, without any challenges, and see no reason to drink any more beyond that. Of course, as a free individual, you can choose to drink more than your sense of thirst tells you, or just enough, or even less!

Ig they may already have had too much. Extreme hydrating creates synptoms similar to oveindulging in alcohol. But that would be extremely extreme quantities not the modest 64 + oz. these guys are chug-a-lugging–burp — Diva ***** The Best Man For The Job Is A Woman

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I read recently (sorry can’t quote the source) that this business of forcing down water is not necessary. Who’s forcing? Let’s say I drink one cup of water and are not thirsty, meaning I do not want any more water. Then, because of some external considerations (for example, a USENET "hydration" challenge going on), not because of thirst, I drink an extra cup. That’s forcing (of that one extra cup). No one is forcing you to drink that extra cup.  Since you’re not participating in our water challenge why even worry about it?  Your negative comments are not welcome nor very supportive of those who do choose to participate in the different challenges in the group. I was answering a question about what’s "forcing". I do not participate in this water challenge because I drink enough not to be thirsty, without any challenges, and see no reason to drink any more beyond that. Of course, as a free individual, you can choose to drink more than your sense of thirst tells you, or just enough, or even less! i Beverly We all know the definition of force.  It isn’t necessary for you to give us your version. I’m glad you drink enough water but for those of us who often neglect to drink enough the challenges often get us back into the healthy habit of drinking sufficient water. Why do you feel the need to even post in these challenge threads when you don’t choose to participate?  You constantly make negative remarks about these challenges.  As I said before, if you can’t be supportive then you might show a little consideration for others in the group and keep these comments to yourself.  As I said before, they’re not supportive and are now welcome. Beverly

Beverly, This is an open discussion group and every protocol advocated by subscribers will not always receive unanimous support and is vulnerable to criticism and even ridicule. (Although I haven’t joined your water challenge I respect your effort to pursue it.) My experience with challenges and strict programs is that I get a heady head start but eventually fizzle, so I am trying to do a method I call ‘thoughtfully spontaneous". Announcements that this week "it will only be 1200 calories daily seem" to fall on deaf ears including my two. LOL! One would hope you honorary Aquarians fare better. Sip on to Handel’s water music — Diva ****** There is no substitute for the right food

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – message SnugBear I read recently (sorry can’t quote the source) that this business of forcing down water is not necessary. Who’s forcing? Let’s say I drink one cup of water and are not thirsty, meaning I do not want any more water. Then, because of some external considerations (for example, a USENET "hydration" challenge going on), not because of thirst, I drink an extra cup. That’s forcing (of that one extra cup). No one is forcing you to drink that extra cup.  Since you’re not participating in our water challenge why even worry about it?  Your negative comments are not welcome nor very supportive of those who do choose to participate in the different challenges in the group. I was answering a question about what’s "forcing". I do not participate in this water challenge because I drink enough not to be thirsty, without any challenges, and see no reason to drink any more beyond that. Of course, as a free individual, you can choose to drink more than your sense of thirst tells you, or just enough, or even less! Ig they may already have had too much. Extreme hydrating creates synptoms similar to oveindulging in alcohol. But that would be extremely extreme quantities not the modest 64 + oz. these guys are chug-a-lugging–burp — Diva ***** The Best Man For The Job Is A Woman

 I doubt any of us are in danger of extreme hydration or presently exhibiting any of the symptoms.  At least we aren’t finding fault and belittling others in the group who are only trying to build healthy habits. Beverly

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – message SnugBear I read recently (sorry can’t quote the source) that this business of forcing down water is not necessary. Who’s forcing? Let’s say I drink one cup of water and are not thirsty, meaning I do not want any more water. Then, because of some external considerations (for example, a USENET "hydration" challenge going on), not because of thirst, I drink an extra cup. That’s forcing (of that one extra cup). No one is forcing you to drink that extra cup.  Since you’re not participating in our water challenge why even worry about it?  Your negative comments are not welcome nor very supportive of those who do choose to participate in the different challenges in the group. I was answering a question about what’s "forcing". I do not participate in this water challenge because I drink enough not to be thirsty, without any challenges, and see no reason to drink any more beyond that. Of course, as a free individual, you can choose to drink more than your sense of thirst tells you, or just enough, or even less! i Beverly We all know the definition of force.  It isn’t necessary for you to give us your version. I’m glad you drink enough water but for those of us who often neglect to drink enough the challenges often get us back into the healthy habit of drinking sufficient water. Why do you feel the need to even post in these challenge threads when you don’t choose to participate?  You constantly make negative remarks about these challenges.  As I said before, if you can’t be supportive then you might show a little consideration for others in the group and keep these comments to yourself.  As I said before, they’re not supportive and are now welcome. Beverly Beverly, This is an open discussion group and every protocol advocated by subscribers will not always receive unanimous support and is vulnerable to criticism and even ridicule. (Although I haven’t joined your water challenge I respect your effort to pursue it.) My experience with challenges and strict programs is that I get a heady head start but eventually fizzle, so I am trying to do a method I call ‘thoughtfully spontaneous". Announcements that this week "it will only be 1200 calories daily seem" to fall on deaf ears including my two. LOL! One would hope you honorary Aquarians fare better. Sip on to Handel’s water music — Diva ****** There is no substitute for the right food

All of us are aware that this is an open discussion group and the decision to join a challenge is up to the individual.  I’m also sure you’re aware that some people constantly belittle other’s efforts to develop healthy habits.  It’s those type of people who aren’t demonstrating the "support" portion of alt.support.diet. Beverly

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – message SnugBear I read recently (sorry can’t quote the source) that this business of forcing down water is not necessary. Who’s forcing? Let’s say I drink one cup of water and are not thirsty, meaning I do not want any more water. Then, because of some external considerations (for example, a USENET "hydration" challenge going on), not because of thirst, I drink an extra cup. That’s forcing (of that one extra cup). No one is forcing you to drink that extra cup.  Since you’re not participating in our water challenge why even worry about it?  Your negative comments are not welcome nor very supportive of those who do choose to participate in the different challenges in the group. I was answering a question about what’s "forcing". I do not participate in this water challenge because I drink enough not to be thirsty, without any challenges, and see no reason to drink any more beyond that. Of course, as a free individual, you can choose to drink more than your sense of thirst tells you, or just enough, or even less! Ig they may already have had too much. Extreme hydrating creates synptoms similar to oveindulging in alcohol. Good point. But that would be extremely extreme quantities not the modest 64 + oz. these guys are chug-a-lugging–burp Some people here drank much more than 64 ounces… 86 ounces http://www.google.com/groups?selm=2q1td6Fqe7klU1%40uni-berlin.de&outp… 112 oz http://www.google.com/groups?selm=ksKdnXoEcOqTrabcRVn-hw%40comcast.co… i

Living up to your chosen name again I see, drama queen.  The quantities mentioned above are *not* harmful to typically healthy adults nor are they "much more" than 64 oz.  While it is possible to drink too much water it is rather difficult to do for the average person. http://my.webmd.com/content/article/62/71686.htm "It is possible to drink too much water — however it is VERY difficult to do." http://www.mayoclinic.com/invoke.cfm?objectid=1488D60D-E694-4EE6-A0DF… or http://tinyurl.com/285mq "Drinking too much water is rare in healthy adults who consume an average American diet." http://chemistry.about.com/cs/5/f/blwaterintox.htm "it’s possible to drink too much water, but unless you are running a marathon or an infant, water intoxication is a very uncommon condition" The guidelines for drinking water are up to an individual based on a number of factors including the amount and intensity of exercise you’re doing and your environment.  64 oz. is a minimum standard actually. You’re only making yourself look completely stupid and while I realize that seems to be a reduntant term in reference to you, it’s not helping your case to avoid looking like an idiot kook. Jenn

Response:

All of us are aware that this is an open discussion group and the decision to join a challenge is up to the individual.  I’m also sure you’re aware that some people constantly belittle other’s efforts to develop healthy habits.  It’s those type of people who aren’t demonstrating the "support" portion of alt.support.diet. Beverly

Well put.  Thank you. Jenn

Response:

Soccer MOMS! LIBERAL feminazis really don't care about women's rights

Question:

Response:

Soccer MOMS! LIBERAL feminazis really don’t care about women’s rights LIBERAL Lessons from Kobe Bryant + Scott Peterson Cases Soccer Moms and other Women! Do you want LIBERAL judges who rule against rape victims? Do you want LIBERAL judges who free murderers? Do you want LIBERAL feminazis who want to kill you and your baby in your pregnancy? Did Lacey Peterson have a "choice"? Do soccer moms want LIBERAL judges + Kobe Bryant + O.J.? WOMEN of the world unite! LIBERAL Demon-KKK-Rat John KKKerry opposes the death penalty, he supports rights for dirty muslim terrorists and criminals, and he promises to appoint LIBERAL judges to the U.S. Supreme Court. By contrast, President George W. Bush and the Party of Lincoln support the death penalty and support TOUGH JUDGES who protect women’s rights to be free from rape, murder, assault, battery, and terrorism. Please protect our sisters, daughters and mothers: vote Bush/Cheney! The Truth about islam http://www.flex.com/~jai/satyamevajayate/ Girl, 16, hanged in public in Iran http://www.iranfocus.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=80 Fri. 20 Aug 2004 On Sunday, August 15, a 16-year-old girl in the town of Neka, northern Iran, was executed. Ateqeh Sahaleh was hanged in public on Simetry Street off Rah Ahan Street at the city center. The sentence was issued by the head of Neka’s Justice Department and subsequently upheld by the mullahs’ Supreme Court and carried out with the approval of Judiciary Chief Mahmoud Shahroudi. In her summary trial, the teenage victim did not have any lawyer and efforts by her family to recruit a lawyer was to no avail. Ateqeh personally defended herself. She told the religious judge, Haji Rezaii, that he should punish the main perpetrators of moral corruption not the victims. The judge personally pursued Ateqeh’s death sentence, beyond all normal procedures and finally gained the approval of the Supreme Court. After her execution Rezai said her punishment was not execution but he had her executed for her "sharp tongue." Feminists Silent on Freedom for Iraqi Women by Lisa De Pasquale http://www.cblpolicyinstitute.org/silenceoniraqiwomen.htm The transfer of sovereignty to the Iraqi government marks a new day for Iraqi women. Thanks to the courageous action taken by the Bush administration and its allies, Iraqi women have renewed freedom. The administration has insisted that women receive educational and small business opportunities, as well as active participation in government. For months radical feminists have been silent on the plight of Iraqi women. Instead this hypocritical bunch has condemned the war in Iraq and its subsequent liberation of women simply because the war is supported by conservatives. In March feminists gathered in front of the White House to protest military action against Saddam Hussein. The protest was called "Code Pink: Women’s Pre-Emptive Strike for Peace." On the other side of the world, Iraqi women were being denied the most basic (Indian)n lived in fear knowing that Iraqi law freely allowed male relatives to murder them in the name of honor. In Iraqi prisons, women were raped and tortured for being related to Iraqi opposition activists. Videotapes of the acts were sent to the families. Despite obvious human rights violations and limits on freedom, feminists, led by the National Organization for Women, ignored Saddam Hussein’s reprehensible treatment of women. Under the Saddam Hussein regime Iraqi women were not allowed to work outside the home. Feminists, on the other hand, talked about America’s "tyrants" and the threat of "tyranny in our homes, our workplaces and our schools." Radical feminists witnessed a legitimate case of tyranny and violence against women in Iraq, but they remained steadfastly against policies and actions taken by America and the Bush administration that helped these women. NOW President Kim Gandy stated, "The real terrorism is the Bush administration’s disregard for international law and destruction of civil liberties at home. This has become an issue of one dictator versus another." Feminists are more comfortable allowing Iraqi women to endure torture than supporting the Bush Administration. For example, a report by Amnesty International documented the beheading of 50 young women in Baghdad. The report also said, "The heads of these women were hung on the doors of their houses for a few days." Saddam’s son Uday led the group of men who beheaded the women and terrorized their families. The US State Department reports that human rights organizations receive continuous testimony on the psychological trauma women have suffered after being tortured and raped by Iraqi military personnel. Despite this overwhelming evidence, feminists in the US praised Iraq and cited a suspicious United Nations report that said Iraq "scored highest in women’s empowerment." Before the capture of Saddam, NOW stated in a press release posted on their website that Iraqi women "currently enjoy more rights and freedoms than women in other Gulf nations, such as Saudi Arabia." At an International Alliance for Justice press conference in 2002, Safia al-Souhail, an Iraqi woman whose father was murdered for opposing Saddam, said, "We are here begging the support of the free world to liberate us from the nightmare we have been living in for the past three decades." Al-Souhail also said, "Disarmament alone will not end our suffering. This regime should be indicted for its crimes against humanity." NOW and their cohorts were deaf to these women’s pleas and still condemn the war in Iraq. Feminists invent problems in the US and ignore the real problems faced by women around the world. NOW accuses President Bush of "reversing women’s rights here and abroad." Feminist Majority leader Eleanor Smeal odiously said that the Bush Administration "needs to construct a foreign policy as if women mattered." The deceptively titled March for Women’s Lives in April brought thousands of feminists and leftist supporters to Washington, DC. Rather than march against the atrocities and violence against women in Iraq and other countries around the world, feminists waved coat hangers and demanded taxpayer-funded abortions. Cybill Shepherd held a sign that said, "Too bad John Ashcroft’s mother didn’t believe in abortion." Amid "Fire Bush," "Tarts for Choice" and other placards feminist icon Gloria Steinem told the crowd, "This government is the greatest danger on earth!" Echoing the hateful and hysterical rhetoric, Senator Hillary Clinton, with no apparent sense of irony regarding the previous administration, said she was there to criticize President Bush for "not upholding laws against sexual harassment and discrimination." These radical feminists’ stance on military action in Iraq and the global war on terrorism illustrate how they have consistently fallen short of their purported mission to "eliminate sexism and eliminate all oppression." Their motives are clearly political and not based on advancing the rights of women around the world. When faced with a war that liberated the Iraqi people, a majority of whom are women, feminists would much rather turn a blind eye to the horrors of Saddam than support America and the Bush Administration.

Response:

Soccer MOMS! LIBERAL feminazis really don’t care about women’s rights LIBERAL Lessons from Kobe Bryant + Scott Peterson Cases Soccer Moms and other Women! Do you want LIBERAL judges who rule against rape victims? Do you want LIBERAL judges who free murderers? Do you want LIBERAL feminazis who want to kill you and your baby in your pregnancy? Do soccer moms want LIBERAL judges + Kobe Bryant + O.J.? Women of the world unite! LIBERAL Demon-KKK-Rat John KKKerry opposes the death penalty, he supports rights for dirty muslim terrorists and criminals, and he promises to appoint LIBERAL judges to the U.S. Supreme Court. By contrast, President George W. Bush and the Party of Lincoln support the death penalty and support TOUGH JUDGES who protect women’s rights to be free from rape, murder, assault, battery, and terrorism. Please protect our sisters, daughters and mothers: vote Bush/Cheney! The Truth about islam http://www.flex.com/~jai/satyamevajayate/ Girl, 16, hanged in public in Iran http://www.iranfocus.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=80 Fri. 20 Aug 2004 On Sunday, August 15, a 16-year-old girl in the town of Neka, northern Iran, was executed. Ateqeh Sahaleh was hanged in public on Simetry Street off Rah Ahan Street at the city center. The sentence was issued by the head of Neka’s Justice Department and subsequently upheld by the mullahs’ Supreme Court and carried out with the approval of Judiciary Chief Mahmoud Shahroudi. In her summary trial, the teenage victim did not have any lawyer and efforts by her family to recruit a lawyer was to no avail. Ateqeh personally defended herself. She told the religious judge, Haji Rezaii, that he should punish the main perpetrators of moral corruption not the victims. The judge personally pursued Ateqeh’s death sentence, beyond all normal procedures and finally gained the approval of the Supreme Court. After her execution Rezai said her punishment was not execution but he had her executed for her "sharp tongue." Feminists Silent on Freedom for Iraqi Women by Lisa De Pasquale http://www.cblpolicyinstitute.org/silenceoniraqiwomen.htm The transfer of sovereignty to the Iraqi government marks a new day for Iraqi women. Thanks to the courageous action taken by the Bush administration and its allies, Iraqi women have renewed freedom. The administration has insisted that women receive educational and small business opportunities, as well as active participation in government. For months radical feminists have been silent on the plight of Iraqi women. Instead this hypocritical bunch has condemned the war in Iraq and its subsequent liberation of women simply because the war is supported by conservatives. In March feminists gathered in front of the White House to protest military action against Saddam Hussein. The protest was called "Code Pink: Women’s Pre-Emptive Strike for Peace." On the other side of the world, Iraqi women were being denied the most basic (Indian)n lived in fear knowing that Iraqi law freely allowed male relatives to murder them in the name of honor. In Iraqi prisons, women were raped and tortured for being related to Iraqi opposition activists. Videotapes of the acts were sent to the families. Despite obvious human rights violations and limits on freedom, feminists, led by the National Organization for Women, ignored Saddam Hussein’s reprehensible treatment of women. Under the Saddam Hussein regime Iraqi women were not allowed to work outside the home. Feminists, on the other hand, talked about America’s "tyrants" and the threat of "tyranny in our homes, our workplaces and our schools." Radical feminists witnessed a legitimate case of tyranny and violence against women in Iraq, but they remained steadfastly against policies and actions taken by America and the Bush administration that helped these women. NOW President Kim Gandy stated, "The real terrorism is the Bush administration’s disregard for international law and destruction of civil liberties at home. This has become an issue of one dictator versus another." Feminists are more comfortable allowing Iraqi women to endure torture than supporting the Bush Administration. For example, a report by Amnesty International documented the beheading of 50 young women in Baghdad. The report also said, "The heads of these women were hung on the doors of their houses for a few days." Saddam’s son Uday led the group of men who beheaded the women and terrorized their families. The US State Department reports that human rights organizations receive continuous testimony on the psychological trauma women have suffered after being tortured and raped by Iraqi military personnel. Despite this overwhelming evidence, feminists in the US praised Iraq and cited a suspicious United Nations report that said Iraq "scored highest in women’s empowerment." Before the capture of Saddam, NOW stated in a press release posted on their website that Iraqi women "currently enjoy more rights and freedoms than women in other Gulf nations, such as Saudi Arabia." At an International Alliance for Justice press conference in 2002, Safia al-Souhail, an Iraqi woman whose father was murdered for opposing Saddam, said, "We are here begging the support of the free world to liberate us from the nightmare we have been living in for the past three decades." Al-Souhail also said, "Disarmament alone will not end our suffering. This regime should be indicted for its crimes against humanity." NOW and their cohorts were deaf to these women’s pleas and still condemn the war in Iraq. Feminists invent problems in the US and ignore the real problems faced by women around the world. NOW accuses President Bush of "reversing women’s rights here and abroad." Feminist Majority leader Eleanor Smeal odiously said that the Bush Administration "needs to construct a foreign policy as if women mattered." The deceptively titled March for Women’s Lives in April brought thousands of feminists and leftist supporters to Washington, DC. Rather than march against the atrocities and violence against women in Iraq and other countries around the world, feminists waved coat hangers and demanded taxpayer-funded abortions. Cybill Shepherd held a sign that said, "Too bad John Ashcroft’s mother didn’t believe in abortion." Amid "Fire Bush," "Tarts for Choice" and other placards feminist icon Gloria Steinem told the crowd, "This government is the greatest danger on earth!" Echoing the hateful and hysterical rhetoric, Senator Hillary Clinton, with no apparent sense of irony regarding the previous administration, said she was there to criticize President Bush for "not upholding laws against sexual harassment and discrimination." These radical feminists’ stance on military action in Iraq and the global war on terrorism illustrate how they have consistently fallen short of their purported mission to "eliminate sexism and eliminate all oppression." Their motives are clearly political and not based on advancing the rights of women around the world. When faced with a war that liberated the Iraqi people, a majority of whom are women, feminists would much rather turn a blind eye to the horrors of Saddam than support America and the Bush Administration.

Response:

Response:

LIBERAL Lessons from Kobe Bryant + Scott Peterson Cases

Question:

What is it about you Neo Nazi rednecks that peddle the bush LIES and feel that you have to steal other peoples names to make your point.. You must be a Chrsitian? Peter Terry is in Australia posting from iprimus.com, while this skinhead posting under my non de plume is posting from gblx.net.

scumbags…the KKK…Neo Nazis and the Bush cheer squad PeterT

Response:

LIBERAL Lessons from Kobe Bryant + Scott Peterson Cases Soccer Moms and other Women! Do you want LIBERAL judges who rule against rape victims? Do you want LIBERAL judges who free murderers? Do you want LIBERAL feminazis who want to kill you and your baby in your pregnancy? Did Lacey Peterson have a "choice"? Do soccer moms want LIBERAL judges + Kobe Bryant + O.J.? WOMEN of the world unite! LIBERAL Demon-KKK-Rat John KKKerry opposes the death penalty, he supports rights for dirty muslim terrorists and criminals, and he promises to appoint LIBERAL judges to the U.S. Supreme Court. By contrast, President George W. Bush and the Party of Lincoln support the death penalty and support TOUGH JUDGES who protect women’s rights to be free from rape, murder, assault, battery, and terrorism. Please protect our sisters, daughters and mothers: vote Bush/Cheney! Feminists Silent on Freedom for Iraqi Women by Lisa De Pasquale http://www.cblpolicyinstitute.org/silenceoniraqiwomen.htm The transfer of sovereignty to the Iraqi government marks a new day for Iraqi women. Thanks to the courageous action taken by the Bush administration and its allies, Iraqi women have renewed freedom. The administration has insisted that women receive educational and small business opportunities, as well as active participation in government. For months radical feminists have been silent on the plight of Iraqi women. Instead this hypocritical bunch has condemned the war in Iraq and its subsequent liberation of women simply because the war is supported by conservatives. In March feminists gathered in front of the White House to protest military action against Saddam Hussein. The protest was called "Code Pink: Women’s Pre-Emptive Strike for Peace." On the other side of the world, Iraqi women were being denied the most basic (Indian)n lived in fear knowing that Iraqi law freely allowed male relatives to murder them in the name of honor. In Iraqi prisons, women were raped and tortured for being related to Iraqi opposition activists. Videotapes of the acts were sent to the families. Despite obvious human rights violations and limits on freedom, feminists, led by the National Organization for Women, ignored Saddam Hussein’s reprehensible treatment of women. Under the Saddam Hussein regime Iraqi women were not allowed to work outside the home. Feminists, on the other hand, talked about America’s "tyrants" and the threat of "tyranny in our homes, our workplaces and our schools." Radical feminists witnessed a legitimate case of tyranny and violence against women in Iraq, but they remained steadfastly against policies and actions taken by America and the Bush administration that helped these women. NOW President Kim Gandy stated, "The real terrorism is the Bush administration’s disregard for international law and destruction of civil liberties at home. This has become an issue of one dictator versus another." Feminists are more comfortable allowing Iraqi women to endure torture than supporting the Bush Administration. For example, a report by Amnesty International documented the beheading of 50 young women in Baghdad. The report also said, "The heads of these women were hung on the doors of their houses for a few days." Saddam’s son Uday led the group of men who beheaded the women and terrorized their families. The US State Department reports that human rights organizations receive continuous testimony on the psychological trauma women have suffered after being tortured and raped by Iraqi military personnel. Despite this overwhelming evidence, feminists in the US praised Iraq and cited a suspicious United Nations report that said Iraq "scored highest in women’s empowerment." Before the capture of Saddam, NOW stated in a press release posted on their website that Iraqi women "currently enjoy more rights and freedoms than women in other Gulf nations, such as Saudi Arabia." At an International Alliance for Justice press conference in 2002, Safia al-Souhail, an Iraqi woman whose father was murdered for opposing Saddam, said, "We are here begging the support of the free world to liberate us from the nightmare we have been living in for the past three decades." Al-Souhail also said, "Disarmament alone will not end our suffering. This regime should be indicted for its crimes against humanity." NOW and their cohorts were deaf to these women’s pleas and still condemn the war in Iraq. Feminists invent problems in the US and ignore the real problems faced by women around the world. NOW accuses President Bush of "reversing women’s rights here and abroad." Feminist Majority leader Eleanor Smeal odiously said that the Bush Administration "needs to construct a foreign policy as if women mattered." The deceptively titled March for Women’s Lives in April brought thousands of feminists and leftist supporters to Washington, DC. Rather than march against the atrocities and violence against women in Iraq and other countries around the world, feminists waved coat hangers and demanded taxpayer-funded abortions. Cybill Shepherd held a sign that said, "Too bad John Ashcroft’s mother didn’t believe in abortion." Amid "Fire Bush," "Tarts for Choice" and other placards feminist icon Gloria Steinem told the crowd, "This government is the greatest danger on earth!" Echoing the hateful and hysterical rhetoric, Senator Hillary Clinton, with no apparent sense of irony regarding the previous administration, said she was there to criticize President Bush for "not upholding laws against sexual harassment and discrimination." These radical feminists’ stance on military action in Iraq and the global war on terrorism illustrate how they have consistently fallen short of their purported mission to "eliminate sexism and eliminate all oppression." Their motives are clearly political and not based on advancing the rights of women around the world. When faced with a war that liberated the Iraqi people, a majority of whom are women, feminists would much rather turn a blind eye to the horrors of Saddam than support America and the Bush Administration.

Response:

LIBERAL Lessons from Kobe Bryant + Scott Peterson Cases Soccer Moms and other Women! Do you want LIBERAL judges who rule against rape victims? Do you want LIBERAL judges who free murderers? Do you want LIBERAL feminazis who want to kill you and your baby in your pregnancy? Did Lacey Peterson have a "choice"? Why Hillary Clinton is an inspiration for all women Hillary stands by her girly-man who is a: + dis-barred lawyer + serial adulterer + serial perjurer and liar + dirty old bastard who preys upon females the same age as his daughter Chappaquiddick Kennedy = Racist + Rapist + Adulterer + Murderer Demon-KKK-Rats have not only lost the Latino, Asian, and Black vote, they’ve also lost the vast soccer mom/professional woman vote as well. It is no coincidence that rapists, adulterers, and murderers like Chappaquiddick Kennedy and Billary KKKlinton are the stars of the Demon-KKK-Ratic party. Racist Ted Kennedy = America’s Pregnant Mistress Killer! Kennedy Calls Bush Minority Nominees ‘Neanderthals’ Sen. Ted Kennedy called President Bush’s judicial nominees "Neanderthals" on Friday, a group that includes Hispanic lawyer Miguel Estrada and African-American Judge Janice Rogers Brown. Boasting of his party’s resolve in the face of GOP attempts to stop the Democrats’ filibuster, Kennedy told the Senate, "What has not ended is the resolution and the determination of the members of the United States Senate to continue to resist any Neanderthal that is nominated by this president of the United States for any court, federal court in the United States." Kennedy’s overtly racist language stunned even liberal CNN correspondent Jonathan Karl, who reported, "Strong words from Ted Kennedy suggesting that some of these nominees are Neanderthals." Karl said Kennedy’s harsh tone was "exactly what Republicans point to when they say it is the Democrats that have been the extremists on this." Carl Limbacher http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/JFKkopechne.htm Do soccer moms want LIBERAL judges + Kobe Bryant + O.J.? WOMEN of the world unite! LIBERAL Demon-KKK-Rat John KKKerry opposes the death penalty, he supports rights for dirty muslim terrorists and criminals, and he promises to appoint LIBERAL judges to the U.S. Supreme Court. By contrast, President George W. Bush and the Party of Lincoln support the death penalty and support TOUGH JUDGES who protect women’s rights to be free from rape, murder, assault, battery, and terrorism. Please protect our sisters, daughters and mothers: vote Bush/Cheney!

Response:

Response:

LIBERAL Lessons from Kobe Bryant + Scott Peterson Cases Soccer Moms and other Women! Do you want LIBERAL judges who rule against rape victims? Do you want LIBERAL judges who free murderers? Do soccer moms want LIBERAL judges + Kobe Bryant + O.J.? Women of the world unite! LIBERAL Demon-KKK-Rat John KKKerry opposes the death penalty, he supports rights for dirty muslim terrorists and criminals, and he promises to appoint LIBERAL judges to the U.S. Supreme Court. By contrast, President George W. Bush and the Party of Lincoln support the death penalty and support TOUGH JUDGES who protect women’s rights to be free from rape, murder, assault, battery, and terrorism. Please protect our sisters, daughters and mothers: vote Bush/Cheney! Feminists Silent on Freedom for Iraqi Women by Lisa De Pasquale http://www.cblpolicyinstitute.org/silenceoniraqiwomen.htm The transfer of sovereignty to the Iraqi government marks a new day for Iraqi women. Thanks to the courageous action taken by the Bush administration and its allies, Iraqi women have renewed freedom. The administration has insisted that women receive educational and small business opportunities, as well as active participation in government. For months radical feminists have been silent on the plight of Iraqi women. Instead this hypocritical bunch has condemned the war in Iraq and its subsequent liberation of women simply because the war is supported by conservatives. In March feminists gathered in front of the White House to protest military action against Saddam Hussein. The protest was called "Code Pink: Women’s Pre-Emptive Strike for Peace." On the other side of the world, Iraqi women were being denied the most basic rights and freedoms. Iraqi women lived in fear knowing that Iraqi law freely allowed male relatives to murder them in the name of honor. In Iraqi prisons, women were raped and tortured for being related to Iraqi opposition activists. Videotapes of the acts were sent to the families. Despite obvious human rights violations and limits on freedom, feminists, led by the National Organization for Women, ignored Saddam Hussein’s reprehensible treatment of women. Under the Saddam Hussein regime Iraqi women were not allowed to work outside the home. Feminists, on the other hand, talked about America’s "tyrants" and the threat of "tyranny in our homes, our workplaces and our schools." Radical feminists witnessed a legitimate case of tyranny and violence against women in Iraq, but they remained steadfastly against policies and actions taken by America and the Bush administration that helped these women. NOW President Kim Gandy stated, "The real terrorism is the Bush administration’s disregard for international law and destruction of civil liberties at home. This has become an issue of one dictator versus another." Feminists are more comfortable allowing Iraqi women to endure torture than supporting the Bush Administration. For example, a report by Amnesty International documented the beheading of 50 young women in Baghdad. The report also said, "The heads of these women were hung on the doors of their houses for a few days." Saddam’s son Uday led the group of men who beheaded the women and terrorized their families. The US State Department reports that human rights organizations receive continuous testimony on the psychological trauma women have suffered after being tortured and raped by Iraqi military personnel. Despite this overwhelming evidence, feminists in the US praised Iraq and cited a suspicious United Nations report that said Iraq "scored highest in women’s empowerment." Before the capture of Saddam, NOW stated in a press release posted on their website that Iraqi women "currently enjoy more rights and freedoms than women in other Gulf nations, such as Saudi Arabia." At an International Alliance for Justice press conference in 2002, Safia al-Souhail, an Iraqi woman whose father was murdered for opposing Saddam, said, "We are here begging the support of the free world to liberate us from the nightmare we have been living in for the past three decades." Al-Souhail also said, "Disarmament alone will not end our suffering. This regime should be indicted for its crimes against humanity." NOW and their cohorts were deaf to these women’s pleas and still condemn the war in Iraq. Feminists invent problems in the US and ignore the real problems faced by women around the world. NOW accuses President Bush of "reversing women’s rights here and abroad." Feminist Majority leader Eleanor Smeal odiously said that the Bush Administration "needs to construct a foreign policy as if women mattered." The deceptively titled March for Women’s Lives in April brought thousands of feminists and leftist supporters to Washington, DC. Rather than march against the atrocities and violence against women in Iraq and other countries around the world, feminists waved coat hangers and demanded taxpayer-funded abortions. Cybill Shepherd held a sign that said, "Too bad John Ashcroft’s mother didn’t believe in abortion." Amid "Fire Bush," "Tarts for Choice" and other placards feminist icon Gloria Steinem told the crowd, "This government is the greatest danger on earth!" Echoing the hateful and hysterical rhetoric, Senator Hillary Clinton, with no apparent sense of irony regarding the previous administration, said she was there to criticize President Bush for "not upholding laws against sexual harassment and discrimination." These radical feminists’ stance on military action in Iraq and the global war on terrorism illustrate how they have consistently fallen short of their purported mission to "eliminate sexism and eliminate all oppression." Their motives are clearly political and not based on advancing the rights of women around the world. When faced with a war that liberated the Iraqi people, a majority of whom are women, feminists would much rather turn a blind eye to the horrors of Saddam than support America and the Bush Administration. #1 Killer of Pregnant Women #1 Killer of Pregnant Women = CRIMINALS = LIBERALS Soccer Moms/Professional Women! Vote KKKerry and you, your daughter(s), and your mother, will be gang raped and murdered by TERRORISTS + CRIMINALS + LIBERAL JUDGES!!! We can only pray that one day Scott Peterson, Kobe Bryant, and O.J. will be free to pay a little visit to feminazis like Gloria Steinem, et al. John Kerry’s Dream Team: Kobe Bryant = Women’s and Marital Affairs Al Qaeda Sharpton = Secretary of Defense Pagones v. Maddux, Mason and Sharpton Tawana Brawley Grand Jury Report http://www.courttv.com/archive/legaldocs/newsmakers/tawana/ O.J. Simpson = Secretary of Health and Human Services 9/11 Commission Recommends Bush Doctrine of Pre-emption Because muslim sub-animals murder, rape, and pillage Christians, Hindus, Buddhists, and others in: + Australia + India + Sudan + Nigeria + Kenya + Tanzania + Philippines + Spain + Thailand + Denmark + Norway + France + Sweden + Germany + etc. Buy it now!: Not Without My Daughter (1991) http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B00005N89Q/ Leonard Pitts, Jr. "This is how muslims stone a woman to death." Leonard Pitts, Jr. The Miami Herald. 3 November 2003. "This is how you stone a woman to death. You bury her up to her neck. Then you heave stones at her head. One imagines her face slowly obliterated, her skull repeatedly broken. One imagines the process takes a long time. One finds it hard to imagine a crueler way to die. Last Thursday, a court in Nigeria spared Amina Lawal that grisly fate. She is a 31-year-old peasant who had been convicted of adultery under sharia law, a religious code based on the Koran. The chief evidence of her "crime": her 2-year-old daughter, Wasila. Lawal has long claimed innocence, saying Wasila’s father promised to marry her. But the man she identified turned out to be married already and denied fathering her child. Three male witnesses corroborated his claim that he never had sex with Lawal. An outsider is at a loss to understand how a man’s friends can authoritatively testify that he did not have intercourse. But their word was enough under sharia law, and the man was acquitted. … Lawal’s exoneration was less sweeping. Judges relied largely on technicalities in setting her free. Their ruling also took into account interpretations of sharia law that hold that an embryo can gestate for up to five years as opposed to the more widely accepted nine months. Something else an outsider finds hard to figure. Still, that fanciful time frame allows for the possibility that Lawal’s ex-husband fathered the child, thus contributing to her acquittal." Obviously, these ignorant muslims hate women and science. Things like DNA and Equal Protection are concepts well beyond the intellectual comprehension of these muslim sub-animals who have no hearts or minds.

Response:

LIBERAL Lessons from Kobe Bryant + Scott Peterson Cases Soccer Moms and other Women! Do you want LIBERAL judges who rule against rape victims? Do you want LIBERAL judges who free murderers? How dirty muslims rape young girls "Down Under" Or what happens when Australia banned guns PROTECT THE 2nd AMENDMENT TO THE U.S. CONSTITUTION! Janet Albrechtsen. The Australian. 7 July 2002. THE French call it tournantes or "take your turn" — the French term for the pack-rape of white girls by young Muslim men. For 20 years the French ignored the ethnic causes of these barbaric crimes for fear of offending multicultural man. Along the way, more innocent young girls were pack-raped. Xenophobia divided communities. And finally, voters punished a Centre-Left government for assuming that the electorate was not grown up enough to discuss race without being racist. Last year Sylvie Lotteau, a magistrate from Bobigny, a northern Paris suburb, described tournantes: "Their technique was to pick up a young girl — a white girl — and once she had become the girlfriend of one of the members, he would allow his mates to make use of her." Now it’s in Australia. Last week two Muslim brothers were found guilty of the gang-rape of a young Australian girl. The victim knew one of the brothers. She was invited for a drive but taken to a secluded park and gang-raped while 14 Muslim boys watched. Racially motivated gang-rape first hit the radar screen in August last year. After the first trial, ethnic leaders such as Sheik Tajedinne Hamed el Hilaly, imam at Lakemba mosque, said the ethnicity of the rapists was irrelevant and simply incited racist attacks on Muslims. But the Muslim community flogged the wrong racists — those Muslim rapists played the race card in the most horrific and demeaning way, taunting victims with "you deserve it because you’re Australian" and threats to "f— you Leb style". And when the judge in the first trial, Megan Latham, tried to douse the flames in an increasingly heated debate about ethnic crime with her gratuitous comments about there being "no racial element", she simply turned up the heat. Since then, evidence on ethnicity-based gang-rapes has mounted. Horrific attacks across Sydney’s southwest reveal the same modus operandi as the French tournantes. Our reaction? Like the French, we pander to sensitivities about race and cultural issues. And so we extend the social and political nightmare of race-based gang-rape. A year ago the barbaric French phenomenon looked vaguely relevant. Now it looks scary and prophetic. When 11 young Muslim men were accused of pack raping a 14-year-old French girl in a cellar, politicians, judges and sociologists finally began to expose and explore the terror of tournantes. "It’s the group effect. They can’t let themselves down in front of their friends, who are urging them to commit the act," said a police commander of a northern Paris suburb. Pack-rape of white girls is an initiation rite of passage for a small section of young male Muslim youth, said Jean-Jacques Rassial, a psychotherapist at Villetaneuse University. "Fraternal bonding now dominates. It is the law of the gang, shorn of any sexual morals," he said. Denmark presents a similar story. Last year, Flemming Balvig, a criminologist at Copenhagen University, confirmed the French experience of this barbaric rite of passage into manhood for some of these young men. French and Danish experts say perpetrators of gang-rape flounder between their parents’ Islamic values and society’s more liberal democratic values falling back on the most basic pack mentality of violence and self-gratification. The progressive Danes offer immigrants advice about the nature of Danish culture and how Denmark’s liberal sexual attitudes cannot be equated with Danish girls "asking for it". Even the wider Arab world is confronting the costs of a culture that can treat women as second-class citizens. Two weeks ago a ground-breaking report by Arab scholars, commissioned by the UN, revealed that half of all Arab women can neither read nor write. The Arab Human Development Report 2002 found that Arab women’s participation in political and economic life rates the lowest in the world. Transplanted to countries such as Australia, a culture which places so little value on gender equality was always going to have problems when faced with women who not only read and write but think and assume control of their lives. Each of those barbaric gang-rapists showed utter disdain for their young Western victims. Yet in Australia racially motivated gang-rape is met by gutless censorship from multicultural man. And like our Muslim leaders, Australian feminists have been unusually quiet on this gender issue. Ignoring it exacerbates it. A large group of Muslim boys involved in these gang-rapes is still at large. The Muslim community’s refusal to acknowledge cultural issues spells disaster for more innocent young women terrorised by Muslim boys hiding behind their ethnicity. Silence also spells disaster politically. Suppressing frank discussion gives a free kick to the next Jean-Marie Le Pen or Pauline Hanson. At the community level, ignoring the link between crime and ethnicity raises the red flag to rednecks who wish to blame all Muslims for the barbarity of a few. This undermines a peaceful, tolerant future for the vast majority of immigrants who embrace Australian values. Discussing race or ethnicity is neither racist nor xenophobic. Tackling problems head on can only encourage further immigration; ignoring them will be immigration’s death knell. Our tolerance of these Muslim pack-rapists simply feeds their intolerance of us. It took the French 20 years to work that out. How long will it take us? Miranda Devine. "Racist rapes: Finally the truth comes out." The Sun-Herald. July 14 2002. So now we know the facts, straight from the Supreme Court, that a group of Lebanese Muslim gang rapists from south-western Sydney hunted their victims on the basis of their ethnicity and subjected them to hours of degrading, dehumanising torture. The young women, and girls as young as 14, were "sluts" and "Aussie pigs", the rapists said. So now that some of the perpetrators are in jail, will those people who cried racism and media "sensationalism" hang their heads in shame? Hardly. The journalists, academics, legal brains and politicians who tried to claim last August that the gang rapes of south-western Sydney were just a run-of-the-mill police blotter story being beaten up by racists, scaremongers and political opportunists don’t ever want to acknowledge the truth about that ugly episode in Australian history. They don’t want to acknowledge the fear and tension that ran through a part of Sydney they rarely visit and can never understand. This newspaper was the first to report the story, which had been common knowledge in police and media circles, and it has never censored the race element. Even last week, with the conviction of two brothers for their part in the gang rape of Miss D, who was 16 when she was held at gunpoint in a Greenacre park, there were media outlets that downplayed the story and air-brushed race from it. Yet the victims have been crying out for the truth to be told. In court on Friday, one victim gave another a card on which she had written In August, when Judge Megan Latham handed out laughably lenient sentences to three men in one gang rape case, which were later more than doubled on appeal, she made a special point of debunking the race link: "There is no evidence before me of any racial element in the commission of these offences," she said. "There is nothing said or done by the offenders which provides the slightest basis for imputing to them some discrimination in terms of the nationality of their victims." Except that later one of the victims complained her victim impact statement had been "censored" of any "ethnic" references by prosecutors intent on a plea bargain. She was convinced she was raped because of her ethnicity. "You deserve it because you’re an Australian," the rapists told her during the five-hour attack. It’s just so inconvenient of the victims to insist on telling the truth. "I looked in his eyes. I had never seen such indifference," one 18-year-old victim, codenamed Miss C, told the court, remembering one of the 14 men who called her "Aussie pig", gang raped her 25 times over a six-hour period in Bankstown and Chullora, and then turned a hose on her. "I’m going to f*** you Leb style," he said. Fourteen gang rapists have been convicted, or pleaded guilty, thanks to the courage of seven victims who testified for days in court as their tormentors smirked nearby, the men’s families threatened them and defence lawyers suggested they had enjoyed the rapes. "They’re very brave, very strong and very courageous young women," said Salvation Army Major Joyce Harmer, who held the hands of many of the victims through the trials. "They knew this was something they had to do." These were racist crimes. They were hate crimes. The rapists chose their victims on the basis of race. That fact is crucial to this story. If the perpetrators had been Anglo-Celtic Australians, the furore would have been enormous. No newspaper would have left out that fact and you can bet the guilt and shame would have been spread far and wide. 10 Tips to Avoid Being Gang Raped by muslims Mark Steyn. "Battered Westerner Syndrome inflicted by myopic muslim defenders." Jewish World Review. 15 Elul, 5762. Last Thursday, in Sydney, the pack leader of a group of Lebanese Muslim gang-rapists was sentenced to 55 years in jail. I suppose I ought to say "Lebanese-Australian" Muslim gang-rapists, since the accused were Australian citizens. But, identity-wise, the rambunctious young lads considered themselves heavy on the Lebanese, light … read more »

Response:

Women need to be RAPED, say LIBERALS + KKKerry + Feminazis

Question:

What is it about you Neo Nazi rednecks that peddle the bush LIES and feel that you have to steal other peoples names to make your point.. Peter Terry is in Australia posting from iprimus.com, while this skinhead posting under my non de plume is posting from gblx.net. scumbags…the KKK…Neo Nazis and the Bush cheer squad PeterT

Response:

Women need to be RAPED, say LIBERALS + KKKerry + Feminazis Do soccer moms want LIBERAL judges + Kobe Bryant + O.J.? Women of the world unite! LIBERAL Demon-KKK-Rat John KKKerry opposes the death penalty, he supports rights for dirty muslim terrorists and criminals, and he promises to appoint LIBERAL judges to the U.S. Supreme Court. By contrast, President George W. Bush and the Party of Lincoln support the death penalty and support TOUGH JUDGES who protect women’s rights to be free from rape, murder, assault, battery, and terrorism. Please protect our sisters, daughters and mothers: vote Bush/Cheney! Feminists Silent on Freedom for Iraqi Women by Lisa De Pasquale http://www.cblpolicyinstitute.org/silenceoniraqiwomen.htm The transfer of sovereignty to the Iraqi government marks a new day for Iraqi women. Thanks to the courageous action taken by the Bush administration and its allies, Iraqi women have renewed freedom. The administration has insisted that women receive educational and small business opportunities, as well as active participation in government. For months radical feminists have been silent on the plight of Iraqi women. Instead this hypocritical bunch has condemned the war in Iraq and its subsequent liberation of women simply because the war is supported by conservatives. In March feminists gathered in front of the White House to protest military action against Saddam Hussein. The protest was called "Code Pink: Women’s Pre-Emptive Strike for Peace." On the other side of the world, Iraqi women were being denied the most basic rights and freedoms. Iraqi women lived in fear knowing that Iraqi law freely allowed male relatives to murder them in the name of honor. In Iraqi prisons, women were raped and tortured for being related to Iraqi opposition activists. Videotapes of the acts were sent to the families. Despite obvious human rights violations and limits on freedom, feminists, led by the National Organization for Women, ignored Saddam Hussein’s reprehensible treatment of women. Under the Saddam Hussein regime Iraqi women were not allowed to work outside the home. Feminists, on the other hand, talked about America’s "tyrants" and the threat of "tyranny in our homes, our workplaces and our schools." Radical feminists witnessed a legitimate case of tyranny and violence against women in Iraq, but they remained steadfastly against policies and actions taken by America and the Bush administration that helped these women. NOW President Kim Gandy stated, "The real terrorism is the Bush administration’s disregard for international law and destruction of civil liberties at home. This has become an issue of one dictator versus another." Feminists are more comfortable allowing Iraqi women to endure torture than supporting the Bush Administration. For example, a report by Amnesty International documented the beheading of 50 young women in Baghdad. The report also said, "The heads of these women were hung on the doors of their houses for a few days." Saddam’s son Uday led the group of men who beheaded the women and terrorized their families. The US State Department reports that human rights organizations receive continuous testimony on the psychological trauma women have suffered after being tortured and raped by Iraqi military personnel. Despite this overwhelming evidence, feminists in the US praised Iraq and cited a suspicious United Nations report that said Iraq "scored highest in women’s empowerment." Before the capture of Saddam, NOW stated in a press release posted on their website that Iraqi women "currently enjoy more rights and freedoms than women in other Gulf nations, such as Saudi Arabia." At an International Alliance for Justice press conference in 2002, Safia al-Souhail, an Iraqi woman whose father was murdered for opposing Saddam, said, "We are here begging the support of the free world to liberate us from the nightmare we have been living in for the past three decades." Al-Souhail also said, "Disarmament alone will not end our suffering. This regime should be indicted for its crimes against humanity." NOW and their cohorts were deaf to these women’s pleas and still condemn the war in Iraq. Feminists invent problems in the US and ignore the real problems faced by women around the world. NOW accuses President Bush of "reversing women’s rights here and abroad." Feminist Majority leader Eleanor Smeal odiously said that the Bush Administration "needs to construct a foreign policy as if women mattered." The deceptively titled March for Women’s Lives in April brought thousands of feminists and leftist supporters to Washington, DC. Rather than march against the atrocities and violence against women in Iraq and other countries around the world, feminists waved coat hangers and demanded taxpayer-funded abortions. Cybill Shepherd held a sign that said, "Too bad John Ashcroft’s mother didn’t believe in abortion." Amid "Fire Bush," "Tarts for Choice" and other placards feminist icon Gloria Steinem told the crowd, "This government is the greatest danger on earth!" Echoing the hateful and hysterical rhetoric, Senator Hillary Clinton, with no apparent sense of irony regarding the previous administration, said she was there to criticize President Bush for "not upholding laws against sexual harassment and discrimination." These radical feminists’ stance on military action in Iraq and the global war on terrorism illustrate how they have consistently fallen short of their purported mission to "eliminate sexism and eliminate all oppression." Their motives are clearly political and not based on advancing the rights of women around the world. When faced with a war that liberated the Iraqi people, a majority of whom are women, feminists would much rather turn a blind eye to the horrors of Saddam than support America and the Bush Administration.

Response:

Fishing again

Question:

Elmo, you belong in Georgia with the rest of us rednecks! <elmoemer…@webtv.net> wrote in message

news:22728-411A8BD5-119@storefull-3258.bay.webtv.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I went fishing again yesterday morning, was standing in the stream with > my fly rod when this football player sized guy wades out and starts > fishing way too close to me. I told him he was crowding me and asked him > to move away.  He ignores me so I say, "Are you deaf or just plain rude, > son?"  He continues to ignore me so I told him I’d just gotten out of > the state prison a little more than a week ago, that I was  in there for > hurting people.  Told him I did  13 years on a 5-10 sentence because I’d > stabbed a couple of guys while I was in.  Then told him if he knew what > was good for him, he’d get the hell on out of here so I didn’t have to > look at him anymore.  Next time I turned around, he was gone.  Finished > catching my limit and headed home, David Allan Coe playing on my car CD > player.  Now if that aint country, I"ll kiss YOUR ass.  :-) > Elmo > http://community.webtv.net/elmoemerson/DocElmosHepFile

Response:

Unlike you buddha boys, us Christians have what’s called The 10 Commandments.  I’m alot of things, but not a liar.  Your problem, Cody, is you don’t have any balls to stand up for yourself in real life, just a big puff of fart gas on the internet.   Elmo ////////////////   You believe him? LOL! Cody <elmoemer…@webtv.net> wrote in message

news:22728-411A8BD5-119@storefull-3258.bay.webtv.net… I went fishing again yesterday morning, was standing in the stream with my fly rod when this football player sized guy wades out and starts fishing way too close to me. I told him he was crowding me and asked him to move away. He ignores me so I say, "Are you deaf or just plain rude, son?" He continues to ignore me so I told him I’d just gotten out of the state prison a little more than a week ago, that I was in there for hurting people. Told him I did 13 years on a 5-10 sentence because I’d stabbed a couple of guys while I was in. Then told him if he knew what was good for him, he’d get the hell on out of here so I didn’t have to look at him anymore. Next time I turned around, he was gone. Finished catching my limit and headed home, David Allan Coe playing on my car CD player. Now if that aint country, I"ll kiss YOUR ass. Elmo http://community.webtv.net/elmoemerson/DocElmosHepFile http://community.webtv.net/elmoemerson/DocElmosHepFile

Response:

I’m just happy he didn’t call my hand, LOL. Elmo ///////// Sounds pretty country to me. I must say Elmo, you have balls Dan <elmoemer…@webtv.net> wrote in message

news:22728-411A8BD5-119@storefull-3258.bay.webtv.net… I went fishing again yesterday morning, was standing in the stream with my fly rod when this football player sized guy wades out and starts fishing way too close to me. I told him he was crowding me and asked him to move away. He ignores me so I say, "Are you deaf or just plain rude, son?" He continues to ignore me so I told him I’d just gotten out of the state prison a little more than a week ago, that I was in there for hurting people. Told him I did 13 years on a 5-10 sentence because I’d stabbed a couple of guys while I was in. Then told him if he knew what was good for him, he’d get the hell on out of here so I didn’t have to look at him anymore. Next time I turned around, he was gone. Finished catching my limit and headed home, David Allan Coe playing on my car CD player. Now if that aint country, I"ll kiss YOUR ass. Elmo http://community.webtv.net/elmoemerson/DocElmosHepFile http://community.webtv.net/elmoemerson/DocElmosHepFile

Response:

Re: Fishing again   Group: alt.support.hepatitis-c Date: Wed, Aug 11, 2004, 11:18pm (CDT+5) From: Dwi…@Me.net (Dwight) elmoemer…@webtv.net wrote:

I went fishing again yesterday morning, was standing in the stream with my fly rod when this football player sized guy wades out and starts fishing way too close to me. I told him he was crowding me and asked him to move away. He ignores me so I say, "Are you deaf or just plain rude, son?" He continues to ignore me so I told him I’d just gotten out of the state prison a little more than a week ago, that I was in there for hurting people. Told him I did 13 years on a 5-10 sentence because I’d stabbed a couple of guys while I was in. Then told him if he knew what was good for him, he’d get the hell on out of here so I didn’t have to look at him anymore. Next time I turned around, he was gone. Finished catching my limit and headed home, David Allan Coe playing on my car CD player. Now if that aint country, I"ll kiss YOUR ass. Elmo http://community.webtv.net/elmoemerson/DocElmosHepFile Elmo, are you taking your copegus again? That’s how I felt everytime I got in my car for a long time. I’m finally able to just laugh and let them go now. Now if I could just get over this lack of tolerance for some of my administrators at school I’d have it made. Dwight ///////// No copegus…..you should have known me when I was taking the stuff.  I did get arrested once while I was taking it.  hehe Elmo http://community.webtv.net/elmoemerson/DocElmosHepFile

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One of these days I might surprise you and show up down there for a visit.  I figured you might enjoy my experience, Thipper.  The best way to get over on someone who’s bigger than you is to convince em that you’re nuts.  ehehe Elmo ////////////// Elmo, you belong in Georgia with the rest of us rednecks! <elmoemer…@webtv.net> wrote in message

news:22728-411A8BD5-119@storefull-3258.bay.webtv.net… I went fishing again yesterday morning, was standing in the stream with my fly rod when this football player sized guy wades out and starts fishing way too close to me. I told him he was crowding me and asked him to move away. He ignores me so I say, "Are you deaf or just plain rude, son?" He continues to ignore me so I told him I’d just gotten out of the state prison a little more than a week ago, that I was in there for hurting people. Told him I did 13 years on a 5-10 sentence because I’d stabbed a couple of guys while I was in. Then told him if he knew what was good for him, he’d get the hell on out of here so I didn’t have to look at him anymore. Next time I turned around, he was gone. Finished catching my limit and headed home, David Allan Coe playing on my car CD player. Now if that aint country, I"ll kiss YOUR ass. Elmo http://community.webtv.net/elmoemerson/DocElmosHepFile http://community.webtv.net/elmoemerson/DocElmosHepFile

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Your right Thip, Elmo would be right at home on the Chattahoohee river in lieu of the White river in Arkansas. I’ve been around a place or two. Buster "Thip" <m…@privacy.net> wrote in message

news:2nvrr5F5au84U1@uni-berlin.de… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Elmo, you belong in Georgia with the rest of us rednecks! > <elmoemer…@webtv.net> wrote in message > news:22728-411A8BD5-119@storefull-3258.bay.webtv.net… > > I went fishing again yesterday morning, was standing in the stream with > > my fly rod when this football player sized guy wades out and starts > > fishing way too close to me. I told him he was crowding me and asked him > > to move away.  He ignores me so I say, "Are you deaf or just plain rude, > > son?"  He continues to ignore me so I told him I’d just gotten out of > > the state prison a little more than a week ago, that I was  in there for > > hurting people.  Told him I did  13 years on a 5-10 sentence because I’d > > stabbed a couple of guys while I was in.  Then told him if he knew what > > was good for him, he’d get the hell on out of here so I didn’t have to > > look at him anymore.  Next time I turned around, he was gone.  Finished > > catching my limit and headed home, David Allan Coe playing on my car CD > > player.  Now if that aint country, I"ll kiss YOUR ass.  :-) > > Elmo > > http://community.webtv.net/elmoemerson/DocElmosHepFile

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> ///////// > No copegus…..you should have known me when I was taking the stuff.  I > did get arrested once while I was taking it.  hehe > Elmo > http://community.webtv.net/elmoemerson/DocElmosHepFile

I was. Dwight Dragon Slayers’ Club:  http://geocities.com/dwightmspage/

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hahaha, rowdy fucker!!!! — Russ Remove "NOSPAM" for replies. <elmoemer…@webtv.net> wrote in message

news:22728-411A8BD5-119@storefull-3258.bay.webtv.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I went fishing again yesterday morning, was standing in the stream with > my fly rod when this football player sized guy wades out and starts > fishing way too close to me. I told him he was crowding me and asked him > to move away.  He ignores me so I say, "Are you deaf or just plain rude, > son?"  He continues to ignore me so I told him I’d just gotten out of > the state prison a little more than a week ago, that I was  in there for > hurting people.  Told him I did  13 years on a 5-10 sentence because I’d > stabbed a couple of guys while I was in.  Then told him if he knew what > was good for him, he’d get the hell on out of here so I didn’t have to > look at him anymore.  Next time I turned around, he was gone.  Finished > catching my limit and headed home, David Allan Coe playing on my car CD > player.  Now if that aint country, I"ll kiss YOUR ass.  :-) > Elmo > http://community.webtv.net/elmoemerson/DocElmosHepFile

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<elmoemer…@webtv.net> wrote > Unlike you buddha boys, us Christians have what’s called The 10 > Commandments.

Yeah, I know: Although most North Americans hold the Ten Commandments in extremely high esteem, many are not very familiar with many of their features: The Decalogue contains on the order of 22 commandments, not ten.      Most people incorrectly believe that the Commandments govern moral behavior in society — to not lie, steal, commit adultery, commit perjury, etc. In reality, the first four commandments are religious in nature, uniquely related to the worship of Yahweh. They promise penalties to those who worship other Gods. When promoted by the government, the Ten Commandments are quite offensive to those adults who do not happen to worship the God of the Hebrew Scriptures.      Some theologians believe that there are two commandments which are routinely broken by many Christians: the possession of images and failure to observe Saturday as the Sabbath.      The Commandment in Exodus 20:5 (the first of ten Roman Catholics and some Lutherans, and the second of ten for other Christians and Jews) promises that the children, grandchildren, great grandchildren and great great grandchildren will be punished for the misdeeds of their fathers. Most Americans would find this an immoral concept — to punish individuals for the actions of an ancestor, perhaps before they were born.       Elmo? How many images do you possess? Ever take a photograph? Do you know we are in the 21st century, not the 13th? >  I’m alot of things, but not a liar.

Another lie. Now, here comes the usual insult, laced with Elmo’s favorite obsession: > Your problem, Cody, > is you don’t have any balls to stand up for yourself in real life, just > a big puff of fart gas on the internet. > Elmo > ////////////////

Sigh, yet another lie. Cody – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> You believe him? > LOL! > Cody > <elmoemer…@webtv.net> wrote in message > news:22728-411A8BD5-119@storefull-3258.bay.webtv.net… > I went fishing again yesterday morning, was standing in the stream with > my fly rod when this football player sized guy wades out and starts > fishing way too close to me. I told him he was crowding me and asked him > to move away. He ignores me so I say, "Are you deaf or just plain rude, > son?" He continues to ignore me so I told him I’d just gotten out of the > state prison a little more than a week ago, that I was in there for > hurting people. Told him I did 13 years on a 5-10 sentence because I’d > stabbed a couple of guys while I was in. Then told him if he knew what > was good for him, he’d get the hell on out of here so I didn’t have to > look at him anymore. Next time I turned around, he was gone. Finished > catching my limit and headed home, David Allan Coe playing on my car CD > player. Now if that aint country, I"ll kiss YOUR ass. Elmo > http://community.webtv.net/elmoemerson/DocElmosHepFile > http://community.webtv.net/elmoemerson/DocElmosHepFile

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Poooooooooot!!!  Pooooooot!!! Toooot, toooot!!!!!!  :-) Elmo /////////////// Yeah, I know: Although most North Americans hold the Ten Commandments in extremely high esteem, many are not very familiar with many of their features: The Decalogue contains on the order of 22 commandments, not ten.

OT: Pets

Question:

I have four cats.  Three male, one female.  One male and the female are 12 years old and the two others are brothers and they are 11 years old.  We rescued the two brothers from my former employers woods.  We named them Milo and Otis.  One is pure black and very much a runt (a mama’s boy too) and the other is a yellow/gold cat and that’s Otis.  The 12 year old male is a tuxedo kitty named Toby and he’s the leader and the most emotional of the bunch.  He’s my snuggly boy.  The female is a daddy’s girl and follows my husband everywhere.  She came from the shelter when she was a kitten…she’s a tabby.  Definitely the queen of the household. They are all wonderful indoor cats.  We used to have an 8 ft fence in Dallas where they had complete run of the backyard and a kitty door so they could go out any time.  Now since the move to Colorado, that’s changed and they have to stay inside, but they’ve adjusted great…amazingly.  But they are definitely family and I sure don’t look forward to anything any of our ashm family has had to go through.  I’ve been very blessed so far that they’ve only had small bouts of arthritis or an intestinal deal. Amazing how much pets mean to us.  Thanks for asking, Dawn. Michelle – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – We’ve all been talking about Molly and Roo (I hope he’s doing better today). I know I couldn’t (and can’t) get by without your support. I reread the posts a couple of times a day. So, just wondering, who has what kind of pets out there, or has this question been answered while I was "away" for almost 5 years! :O/ I have a Black Lab-Muffin (she’s really depressed right now, you can tell that she senses Molly), a Maine Coone-originally named Crystal, changed to Princess (which I call her), and my parents call her "the Bear" (sorry Bear! ;o) ), I also have 2 Calicos, one dark, Willow, and one light Dru (actually Drucilla, but I hate that name, ex-boyfriend named her) both Calicos named for Buffy the Vampire Slayer characters. ~Dawn *Animals are such agreeable friends they ask no questions, they pass no criticisms.* –George Eliot

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Mum has a 1/2 Yorkie, 1/2 Chihuahua (a Chorkie) named Marty – we decided Chorkie is too nice a name for the little devil, and decided he is a Yor-Hua-Hua (Your-Wa-Wa) instead! Actually, he is amazingly good to me when I am not well – Mum too.  The rest of the time he is continually looking for the next thing to get into trouble doing! Marty the Maniacal Menace, we call him often.  Today he is being good to me as he must know it is shot day! Auntie Jane *Courage is the power to let go of the familiar* – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – We’ve all been talking about Molly and Roo (I hope he’s doing better today). I know I couldn’t (and can’t) get by without your support. I reread the posts a couple of times a day. So, just wondering, who has what kind of pets out there, or has this question been answered while I was "away" for almost 5 years! :O/ I have a Black Lab-Muffin (she’s really depressed right now, you can tell that she senses Molly), a Maine Coone-originally named Crystal, changed to Princess (which I call her), and my parents call her "the Bear" (sorry Bear! ;o) ), I also have 2 Calicos, one dark, Willow, and one light Dru (actually Drucilla, but I hate that name, ex-boyfriend named her) both Calicos named for Buffy the Vampire Slayer characters. ~Dawn *Animals are such agreeable friends they ask no questions, they pass no criticisms.* –George Eliot

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Two Portuguese Water Dogs here….. Ripple and Manny. Liz – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – We’ve all been talking about Molly and Roo (I hope he’s doing better today). I know I couldn’t (and can’t) get by without your support. I reread the posts a couple of times a day. So, just wondering, who has what kind of pets out there, or has this question been answered while I was "away" for almost 5 years! :O/ I have a Black Lab-Muffin (she’s really depressed right now, you can tell that she senses Molly), a Maine Coone-originally named Crystal, changed to Princess (which I call her), and my parents call her "the Bear" (sorry Bear! ;o) ), I also have 2 Calicos, one dark, Willow, and one light Dru (actually Drucilla, but I hate that name, ex-boyfriend named her) both Calicos named for Buffy the Vampire Slayer characters. ~Dawn *Animals are such agreeable friends they ask no questions, they pass no criticisms.* –George Eliot

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I often wish I had the guts to find the owners and take my dog and have him use their yard and walk him all over their cars!!! We have a fenced yard and it keeps the marauding dogs out (mostly) but not the cats!!!! Good for you for being a responsible cat owner! mk   I have four cats.  Three male, one female.  One male and the female are 12   years old and the two others are brothers and they are 11 years old.  We   rescued the two brothers from my former employers woods.  We named them Milo   and Otis.  One is pure black and very much a runt (a mama’s boy too) and the   other is a yellow/gold cat and that’s Otis.  The 12 year old male is a   tuxedo kitty named Toby and he’s the leader and the most emotional of the   bunch.  He’s my snuggly boy.  The female is a daddy’s girl and follows my   husband everywhere.  She came from the shelter when she was a kitten…she’s   a tabby.  Definitely the queen of the household.   They are all wonderful indoor cats.  We used to have an 8 ft fence in Dallas   where they had complete run of the backyard and a kitty door so they could   go out any time.  Now since the move to Colorado, that’s changed and they   have to stay inside, but they’ve adjusted great…amazingly.  But they are   definitely family and I sure don’t look forward to anything any of our ashm   family has had to go through.  I’ve been very blessed so far that they’ve   only had small bouts of arthritis or an intestinal deal.   Amazing how much pets mean to us.  Thanks for asking, Dawn.   Michelle   We’ve all been talking about Molly and Roo (I hope he’s doing better   today). I know I couldn’t (and can’t) get by without your support. I   reread the posts a couple of times a day.   So, just wondering, who has what kind of pets out there, or has this   question been answered while I was "away" for almost 5 years! :O/   I have a Black Lab-Muffin (she’s really depressed right now, you can   tell that she senses Molly), a Maine Coone-originally named Crystal,   changed to Princess (which I call her), and my parents call her "the   Bear" (sorry Bear! ;o) ), I also have 2 Calicos, one dark, Willow, and   one light Dru (actually Drucilla, but I hate that name, ex-boyfriend   named her) both Calicos named for Buffy the Vampire Slayer characters.   ~Dawn     *Animals are such agreeable friends they ask no questions, they pass   no criticisms.*   –George Eliot

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and my parents call her "the Bear" (sorry Bear! ;o)

No need to be sorry,, I willingly share the name with anyone it fits. My real name is Jim Peterson,, so I’m very use to sharing my name, even when I lived in a town of under 250 people there were 3 of us. Bear

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My mom and I are on our third cat. He is a 30lb. black and white domestic house cat. He is 10 1/2 years old. We got him when he was 1 1/2 years old fron the local shelter after our second cat was put to sleep. Our second cat was a Calico cat. We moved to San Diego 10 years ago with our Calico cat and a year after we moved here our Calico got sick and we had to put her to sleep, so the next day we went to the local shelter and got our latest cat. Our first cat was a Siamese cat and she lived to be 20 years old and she died of old age. When we had our Siamese cat we got our Calico cat when the Siamese was 19 years old and we had both the Siamese and Calico living together for a year when our Siamese cat died. Our latest cat has chronic consitpation, but he is a sweet and loving cat. Barbara Booth

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In our house we have a herd of cats,, we have the ladycats Sundance, Nissa, Dogfood and M’Calica and the among the former boycats we have. Car-bait, Garfield, Spook, Salem, Reggie, Pounce De Lione and my therapy cat, Casper. Bear

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We’ve all been talking about Molly and Roo (I hope he’s doing better today). I know I couldn’t (and can’t) get by without your support. I reread the posts a couple of times a day.

Roo is home, Dawn (see post today in "The short happy life of Roo") I’ll tell Roo you asked about him if I can make him hear. So, just wondering, who has what kind of pets out there ….

My roster: Members of household: Clementine (dingo dog) and Roo (le chat). Local denizens of my woods: Jimmy D (the possum), Hot Dogs 1 through 12 (the barn swallows), Snavely (the blacksnake), Mole Ester (the mole), Wiley (the bobcat), Albert (the lizard Roo ate that has somehow been resurrected), Howland (the barred owl), Ossie (the crow) and Bandito (the raccoon). With apologies to A.A. Milne and Walt Kelly. —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 100,000 Newsgroups – 19 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

I live alone with Charlie, a 4 year old cream colored Standard Poodle.  I’m getting ready, today, to leave for a Maine vacation tomorrow & will be taking Charlie to "sleepover camp" any minute now.  People ask me how he likes it there & I honestly don’t know.  He acts fine, so he’s apparently at least not too unhappy there.  They will give him a compatible roommate in the kennel, but no longer will keep him as a house dog.  The last time he was one of the "house dogs" there, he got free & disappeared for over 24 hours.  This was in the swamplands of interior Florida, where bears & alligators are not infrequently sighted.  Fortunately, Charlie returned with only 4 injured paw pads to show for the adventure.  Since then, I’ve called the kennel "camp runaway", but I’ve recently taken to the more positive name of "sleepover camp"

Response:

I live alone with Charlie, a 4 year old cream colored Standard Poodle.  I’m getting ready, today, to leave for a Maine vacation tomorrow & will be taking Charlie to "sleepover camp" any minute now.  People ask me how he likes it there & I honestly don’t know.  He acts fine, so he’s apparently at least not too unhappy there.  They will give him a compatible roommate in the kennel, but no longer will keep him as a house dog.  The last time he was one of the "house dogs" there, he got free & disappeared for over 24 hours.  This was in the swamplands of interior Florida, where bears & alligators are not infrequently sighted.  Fortunately, Charlie returned with only 4 injured paw pads to show for the adventure.  Since then, I’ve called the kennel "camp runaway", but I’ve recently taken to the more positive name of "sleepover camp"

Catherine, Charlie might like Main (a relief from the humidity of the Florida swamps). As you know, John Steinbeck took his Charlie with him nall over the USA. As a matter of fact, I think they visited Main. BobB —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 100,000 Newsgroups – 19 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

We have a Portuguese Water Dog, Sophie, who is 19 months old, black and curly with two white spots on her front. Outdoors we have a feral (but very sweet and cuddly when he wants to be) long-haired brownish-grey neutered male cat, 7 years old, named Kitty Boy Floyd the Outlaw, Oklahoma Knew Him Well. Kitty Boy’s nickname is Dirt Kitty, because he is the same colour as the soil here and he likes to roll around in the dirt paths to attract attention and teasingly signal that he is almost kinda maybe willing to be petted sorta … not.) We also have 7 chickens — 1 black frizzled banty rooster (Reverend Watson), and 6 hens — 2 brown Auracanas (Vivian and Blanche), 1 Silver Laced Wyandotte (Spinner), 2 black Polish-Minorca crosses (the Crow Sisters), and a solid gray daughter of one of the Crow Sisters (The Grey One). The oldest hens, the Crow Sisters, are well over 12 years old; the others are much younger. There are many other inhabitants on this two acre lot whom we know by sight and sound — Steller’s Jays, Spotted Towhees, Grey Squirrels, Possums, Norway rats, Field Mice, Moles, Gophers, Acorn Woodpeckers, Red Tailed Hawks, Screech Owls, Anna’s Hummingbirds, Chickadees, and so forth. Cordially, cat yronwode

Response:

So, just wondering, who has what kind of pets out there,

We have a smelly black male Lhasa Apso (Norbu), an ancient black kitty (Boogie- originally named Baldric but my 11 year old could only say "boogie" when he was a baby so it kinda stuck), and a feisty grey cockatiel (Louie the Fly) who mostly lives out of his cage. Hope

Response:

We have a Portuguese Water Dog, Sophie, who is 19 months old, black and curly with two white spots on her front. Outdoors we have a feral (but very sweet and cuddly when he wants to be) long-haired brownish-grey neutered male cat, 7 years old, named Kitty Boy Floyd

<snip First the background.  We have recently inherited a newborn kitten. His umbilical cord was still attached when my wife found him at work. We have been nursing him via a syringe at first and now with a small bottle & nipple.  He is doing good and his eyes just opened today. The little goomer screams like a banshee when he is hungry and now scarfs down the bottle with loud suckling noises.  He holds it with his paws as well.   Since he was so young when we found him I didn’t want to name him in case he died.  Now that he looks like he is going to make it, one helluva strong will to live on that boy, I need to come up with a name.  I really liked the Kitty Boy Floyd moniker, but my wife & daughters shot it down in flames.  He is sort of black/gray/tan striped color.  Looks a little weird right now as his ears stickout sideways as opposed to straight-up. So since ya`all are Cat folks and this is the very first one we have ever had, anybody got a name suggestion?  

Response:

We have a twelve and a half year old pitbull, Ripley.  She is spayed.  I got her for free at six and half weeks old, and have spent several thousand dollars over the years for knee surgeries (2), hematomas in her ears (3), and severe air borne allergies.  In the last year she has gone deaf.  When I brought home a "pitbull" my Mom threatened to move out because she heard such bad things about them.  Of course, she learned that it all depends how they are raised.  Ripley loves every person she meets, but she used to be hell on small mammals that would come into our backyard, especially skunks. My second dog is Elsa, a brasilian mastiff.  They are known as Fila Brasileiro, or just Fila.  They are a rare breed and I joined the Fila Brasileiro Club of America so I could get info on the breed.  Elsa was a rescue.  I got her at four months of age from a lady that rescued her from a puppymill.  She had several congenital problems and the original owner was going to just let her die.  Her three brothers had been sold for $1500 each, but she need entropian repair (eye surgery) and had vaginal problems and a flea infestation.  Fila have an innate distrust of strangers and are not the dog for everyone.  You must be aware of your surroundings when walking and not let them out without supervision.   At eight years of age, Elsa had stomach torsion, which required surgery.  Several thousand dollars later and a special diet for a year, she is fully recovered and now a healthy ten and half years old.  She is showing some elbow displaysia, which is common for her breed.  We give both dogs Vitamin C and Glucosamine Chondroitin supplements and feed them Canidae Senior dog food.  They also like their dog cookies, getting rewarded for going potty and just being generally good dogs. The cat, Jesse, is a Manx that I bought as a kitten seven years ago.  I had a Manx cat previously who was great and wanted another one.  The first Manx was a rescue, so I looked for another rescue, but didn’t find one.  I found an ad in the paper for a female kitten.  When I went to see her I fell in love.  Her full name is Napaisque’s Princess Jessica Picune.  Napaisque is the cattery name and in french means "without tails", good name for a Manx cattery!  Her mother was Queen Apache, so I continued the native american theme with Picune, which is a tribe of the black foot indians.  Yes, Jesse does have black feet.  She is a patched silver tabby with tortiseshell splotches, which is commonly called Torby.  She has very luxurious medium length fur that reminds me of a chinchilla.  She is very spoiled by my Dad, who feeds her every time she screams at him.  She also brings in small animals: rats, mice, doves, etc.  She usually brings them in alive and lets them go in the house so she can play with them at her leisure. Last but not least, I have a Cherry Headed Conure, named Binkley.  He is named after a cartoon character, Mike Binkley, who was in Bloom County with Opus and Bill the Cat.  Mike Binkley had red hair and was prominently featured with his anxiety closet.  The parrot Binkley has a red head and plucks his feathers.  The vet says it is a neuroses.  I think it’s because he was grabbed by a dog a few years ago and had to have stitches to close a hole in his breast.  I also had to give him antibiotics twice a day, using a tiny hypodermic.  Every since then, he has been plucking his feathers.  I recently purchased some Bach’s Flower Essences Rescue Remedy.  One drop per day, and he is getting better. I’ve researched his breed, family Aratinga, and learned that they can live forty years.  He is about twelve now and was caught by a neighbor who thought he was another neighbor’s runaway parrot.  The other parrot was a Mitred Conure, a little bigger and less red.  The neighbor new it wasn’t his bird, but tried to handle him anyway.  Apparently, the parrot didn’t like men and bit him.  Long story short, the neighbor asked me if I wanted a bird and a bird cage.  I’ve tamed him somewhat over the years and he rides on my shoulder during evening walks in the summer time.  He likes me to cuddle him and he likes to preen my arm hair.  I guess this means we are a couple. Anyway, that’s the clan at our house.  Karen in San Diego – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – We’ve all been talking about Molly and Roo (I hope he’s doing better today). I know I couldn’t (and can’t) get by without your support. I reread the posts a couple of times a day. So, just wondering, who has what kind of pets out there, or has this question been answered while I was "away" for almost 5 years! :O/ I have a Black Lab-Muffin (she’s really depressed right now, you can tell that she senses Molly), a Maine Coone-originally named Crystal, changed to Princess (which I call her), and my parents call her "the Bear" (sorry Bear! ;o) ), I also have 2 Calicos, one dark, Willow, and one light Dru (actually Drucilla, but I hate that name, ex-boyfriend named her) both Calicos named for Buffy the Vampire Slayer characters. ~Dawn *Animals are such agreeable friends they ask no questions, they pass no criticisms.* –George Eliot

Response:

I have lost cats before and I’m not particular to letting mine run a neighborhood for that reason.  Because our cats had been declawed, we had the large fence and a wonderful backyard for them in Dallas.  Being in Colorado, we don’t have that fence and we get other people’s animals roaming onto our deck and one cat broke my brand new bird bath…had not even gotten into the garden yet.  It makes me furious when animals wander up to my deck or windows and irritate my cats…who are safe indoors.  Given their druthers, however, my cats would bolt outside if they had the chance Michelle   I often wish I had the guts to find the owners and take my dog and have him use their yard and walk him all over their cars!!!   We have a fenced yard and it keeps the marauding dogs out (mostly) but not the cats!!!!   Good for you for being a responsible cat owner!   mk     I have four cats.  Three male, one female.  One male and the female are 12     years old and the two others are brothers and they are 11 years old.  We     rescued the two brothers from my former employers woods.  We named them Milo     and Otis.  One is pure black and very much a runt (a mama’s boy too) and the     other is a yellow/gold cat and that’s Otis.  The 12 year old male is a     tuxedo kitty named Toby and he’s the leader and the most emotional of the     bunch.  He’s my snuggly boy.  The female is a daddy’s girl and follows my     husband everywhere.  She came from the shelter when she was a kitten…she’s     a tabby.  Definitely the queen of the household.     They are all wonderful indoor cats.  We used to have an 8 ft fence in Dallas     where they had complete run of the backyard and a kitty door so they could     go out any time.  Now since the move to Colorado, that’s changed and they     have to stay inside, but they’ve adjusted great…amazingly.  But they are     definitely family and I sure don’t look forward to anything any of our ashm     family has had to go through.  I’ve been very blessed so far that they’ve     only had small bouts of arthritis or an intestinal deal.     Amazing how much pets mean to us.  Thanks for asking, Dawn.     Michelle     We’ve all been talking about Molly and Roo (I hope he’s doing better     today). I know I couldn’t (and can’t) get by without your support. I     reread the posts a couple of times a day.     So, just wondering, who has what kind of pets out there, or has this     question been answered while I was "away" for almost 5 years! :O/     I have a Black Lab-Muffin (she’s really depressed right now, you can     tell that she senses Molly), a Maine Coone-originally named Crystal,     changed to Princess (which I call her), and my parents call her "the     Bear" (sorry Bear! ;o) ), I also have 2 Calicos, one dark, Willow, and     one light Dru (actually Drucilla, but I hate that name, ex-boyfriend     named her) both Calicos named for Buffy the Vampire Slayer characters.     ~Dawn         *Animals are such agreeable friends they ask no questions, they pass     no criticisms.*     –George Eliot

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A suggested name…. Norton (the cat sounds like a scottish fold’s ears) and Norton is the name of a rather famous scottish fold cat! Tara (who is actually a Dog person, but has two cats also) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – We have a Portuguese Water Dog, Sophie, who is 19 months old, black and curly with two white spots on her front. Outdoors we have a feral (but very sweet and cuddly when he wants to be) long-haired brownish-grey neutered male cat, 7 years old, named Kitty Boy Floyd <snip First the background.  We have recently inherited a newborn kitten. His umbilical cord was still attached when my wife found him at work. We have been nursing him via a syringe at first and now with a small bottle & nipple.  He is doing good and his eyes just opened today. The little goomer screams like a banshee when he is hungry and now scarfs down the bottle with loud suckling noises.  He holds it with his paws as well.   Since he was so young when we found him I didn’t want to name him in case he died.  Now that he looks like he is going to make it, one helluva strong will to live on that boy, I need to come up with a name.  I really liked the Kitty Boy Floyd moniker, but my wife & daughters shot it down in flames.  He is sort of black/gray/tan striped color.  Looks a little weird right now as his ears stickout sideways as opposed to straight-up. So since ya`all are Cat folks and this is the very first one we have ever had, anybody got a name suggestion?  

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My suggestion…wait a tad longer and look for his behavior to show.  He sounds adorable…I’ve done that too with a kitten and it’s unbelievable to see them survive…good for you guys.  Most people would have just dropped it off at a vet or shelter and let it be. Another suggestion is to go out to some of the cat sites where they have the pictures and look at the cat’s names, then you kind of see some cats and names together and it makes you think "that’s kind of cool."  My cats are Toby, Boo boo, Milo, and Otis. Just a thought.  Congratulations on the new addition…you’re in for a treat Michelle

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – We have a Portuguese Water Dog, Sophie, who is 19 months old, black and curly with two white spots on her front. Outdoors we have a feral (but very sweet and cuddly when he wants to be) long-haired brownish-grey neutered male cat, 7 years old, named Kitty Boy Floyd <snip First the background.  We have recently inherited a newborn kitten. His umbilical cord was still attached when my wife found him at work. We have been nursing him via a syringe at first and now with a small bottle & nipple.  He is doing good and his eyes just opened today. The little goomer screams like a banshee when he is hungry and now scarfs down the bottle with loud suckling noises.  He holds it with his paws as well. Since he was so young when we found him I didn’t want to name him in case he died.  Now that he looks like he is going to make it, one helluva strong will to live on that boy, I need to come up with a name.  I really liked the Kitty Boy Floyd moniker, but my wife & daughters shot it down in flames.  He is sort of black/gray/tan striped color.  Looks a little weird right now as his ears stickout sideways as opposed to straight-up. So since ya`all are Cat folks and this is the very first one we have ever had, anybody got a name suggestion?

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I am sure they would.  I am also sure my dog would love to roam free wherever he wants and eat whatever he wants etc….but we don’t let him. We feed birds and squirrels and such in our yard, and it infuriates me to lose them to stalking cats.  I know the cat is doing what he is made to do.  To bad the humans aren’t doing what THEY should!!!   I have lost cats before and I’m not particular to letting mine run a neighborhood for that reason.  Because our cats had been declawed, we had the large fence and a wonderful backyard for them in Dallas.  Being in Colorado, we don’t have that fence and we get other people’s animals roaming onto our deck and one cat broke my brand new bird bath…had not even gotten into the garden yet.  It makes me furious when animals wander up to my deck or windows and irritate my cats…who are safe indoors.  Given their druthers, however, my cats would bolt outside if they had the chance   Michelle

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – We have a Portuguese Water Dog, Sophie, who is 19 months old, black and curly with two white spots on her front. Outdoors we have a feral (but very sweet and cuddly when he wants to be) long-haired brownish-grey neutered male cat, 7 years old, named Kitty Boy Floyd <snip First the background.  We have recently inherited a newborn kitten. His umbilical cord was still attached when my wife found him at work. We have been nursing him via a syringe at first and now with a small bottle & nipple.  He is doing good and his eyes just opened today. The little goomer screams like a banshee when he is hungry and now scarfs down the bottle with loud suckling noises.  He holds it with his paws as well. Since he was so young when we found him I didn’t want to name him in case he died.  Now that he looks like he is going to make it, one helluva strong will to live on that boy, I need to come up with a name.  I really liked the Kitty Boy Floyd moniker, but my wife & daughters shot it down in flames.  He is sort of black/gray/tan striped color.  Looks a little weird right now as his ears stickout sideways as opposed to straight-up. So since ya`all are Cat folks and this is the very first one we have ever had, anybody got a name suggestion?

LOL! Zomby, I knew there was a soft spot in there somewhere!  That is so sweet, they *are* just like little babies aren’t they?  But wait!!!  Your first one, trust me, sometimes it’s very difficult to determine the sex when they’re that tiny, are you *sure* it’s a boy?  Considering  your *name*, Boris comes to mind for his name, as does Heathcliff, Alfred, Houdini, Church, Gage… Hugs, ~Sage

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Hi Zomby Woof~   I think Michelle has a good idea, wait a few days or so and try out a few names to see what fits him…We are cat AND dog people, thanks to my 13 yr. old son who has taken in just about every stray that he comes across!!  We’ve since put a hault to that, now that we have 3 cats, 2 dogs and a tourtese (sp?)…   Our cats names are Fat Cat (because she was fat when she came to us!),  Asia (who is a black, part Siamese cat) and Buddy (who is actually Asia’s half brother) — we used to let Asia out in the front yard in the evenings for a little while and this darling little grey kitten would come up to her and rub his head on her, he’s so loving still…so when I’d let Asia out and see Buddy come running up to her, I’d say, "Asia, here comes your little buddy!" and so that’s how we got his name!     Our dogs are Foxy (he looks like a little golden fox) and our latest is a little boy puppy (we aren’t sure what kind he is, but he is black and has brindle markings on his paws, doesn’t look like he’s gonna be a big dog) I thought he looked like a Sam or Jack or something like that and my son wanted to name him Holmes, but I knew we’d end up calling him Homey, and I thought it was too "gang" like sounding!   Anyway, my son and his friend had found the puppy and his sister in a field and his friend was thinking up names for his, (he kept the girl) and one of them was Coochina, which we think means dirty girl in Portugese or Spanish (and not the type of dirty that you get from dirt!!) so I suggested that we could name ours Coochino (the male version) and call him Chino or something like that, well we ended up calling him Coochie, and for some reason it seems to fit him.     So I would agree with Michelle and think about it, get ideas, toss a few names around and you’ll come up with one that fits him!  Good Luck.  Take Care. Love, Sheri  :-)

"My suggestion…wait a tad longer and look for his behavior to show."

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Funny/well not so funny story if you look at it wrong.  When we lived in Dallas, I put a small bird feeder in the backyard.  Unfortunately, it was too low so the birds would fly down to it and the kitties would get them.  My husband thought I was some kind of sicko..but I was just being flighty (in my own way).  He thought I was luring them in for the cats   No, just being dumb. I know exactly what you mean.  We enjoy all the birds we see now and the cats do from the windows too  I hate have stalkers come through.  We even had a dog come into the backyard one morning and start licking our grill brush that had fallen on the patio…good grief!   I am sure they would.  I am also sure my dog would love to roam free wherever he wants and eat whatever he wants etc….but we don’t let him.   We feed birds and squirrels and such in our yard, and it infuriates me to lose them to stalking cats.  I know the cat is doing what he is made to do.  To bad the humans aren’t doing what THEY should!!!     I have lost cats before and I’m not particular to letting mine run a neighborhood for that reason.  Because our cats had been declawed, we had the large fence and a wonderful backyard for them in Dallas.  Being in Colorado, we don’t have that fence and we get other people’s animals roaming onto our deck and one cat broke my brand new bird bath…had not even gotten into the garden yet.  It makes me furious when animals wander up to my deck or windows and irritate my cats…who are safe indoors.  Given their druthers, however, my cats would bolt outside if they had the chance     Michelle

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You can see my three at http://uk.f2.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/wafflycat/detail?.dir=/c59d&.dnm=… & clicking through the album Cheers, helen s –This is an invalid email address to avoid spam– to get correct one remove fame & fortune –Due to financial crisis the light at the end of the tunnel is switched off–

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Helen, wonderful kitties.  They look like snugglers. Michelle You can see my three at

http://uk.f2.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/wafflycat/detail?.dir=/c59d&.dnm=… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – & clicking through the album Cheers, helen s –This is an invalid email address to avoid spam– to get correct one remove fame & fortune –Due to financial crisis the light at the end of the tunnel is switched off–

Response:

In our house we have a herd of cats, Check out http://www.thedierks.com/allowe/video/EDS,CatHerding.MPG Are you up to real cat herding? Kadee

It does seem a lot like that some days, Bear

Response:

We’ve all been talking about Molly and Roo (I hope he’s doing better today). I know I couldn’t (and can’t) get by without your support. I reread the posts a couple of times a day. So, just wondering, who has what kind of pets out there, or has this question been answered while I was "away" for almost 5 years! :O/ I have a Black Lab-Muffin (she’s really depressed right now, you can tell that she senses Molly), a Maine Coone-originally named Crystal, changed to Princess (which I call her), and my parents call her "the Bear" (sorry Bear! ;o) ), I also have 2 Calicos, one dark, Willow, and one light Dru (actually Drucilla, but I hate that name, ex-boyfriend named her) both Calicos named for Buffy the Vampire Slayer characters. ~Dawn *Animals are such agreeable friends they ask no questions, they pass no criticisms.* –George Eliot

Response:

Message From native indian chief Arvol Looking Horse

Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – no one can run so far that their karma will not catch up with them. It is better for them to face up to their responsiblities in the current period. When your consciousness transcends karma then karma has no power over you.   I have heard of this concept.  It is apparently a new paradigm (paradigm for the new age?).   This concept comes directly from the mouth of Sri Guru WisheyWasheyBullKorn. In an era when instant gratification is very popular, many guru’s are finding that it is easy to sell instant evolution. It’s perfect for those who are very interested in maintaining a high degree of personal comfort and selfishness, who believe only what they want to believe – because anything else would take them out of their comfort zone. They won’t always be deeply in love with themselfs, not if they’re evolving! Transcending Karma.  Ha!

Transcending Karma does sound like a bunch of nonsense.  It is nonsense to think that we can put ourselves above the laws of cause and effect…even by meditation…because we take action to sit down and meditate…and there will be a reaction to it…therefore karma cannot be transcended. However, when one knows truth and is unified with God it is said that He/She has reached perfection…is no longer the doer but the watcher.  Automatically they have fullfilled the laws of Karma as Christ said "I came to fulfill the law"…and they are walking in unision with the all-pervading…they no longer are tied to the bondage of karma…since they are the watcher and NOt-the-doer.  This does not mean that the enlightened one will break the laws of karma…on the contrary they will be operating effortlessly on the highest of these laws…because they have united themselves with the all-pervading. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – KB "Truth like the sun, submits to be obscured; but like the sun, only for a  time." Bovee "We cannot move on if we are entrapped in structures of economic or cultural privilege. Sharing, especially in a world where most live at or below the edge of misery, is as important and relevant as disarmament; in fact, sharing the resources of the earth is inseparable from the renunciation of  war and violence. On such… ground, the architecture of a new world order based on human unity will be easy to conceive and enact." Richard Falk

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"A new century nears, and with it the prospects of a new civilization. Could we not begin to lay the basis for that new community with reasonable relations among all people and nations, and to build a world in which sharing, justice, freedom and peace might prevail?"